Possible free rebirth system revision

[Maenad]

I posted this in another thread, but I feel like it's interesting enough for its own topic and less of a tweak than a change.

Anyways,
One of the main things making Mabinogi so difficult(Especially for free players) is the amount of time you need to spend to get anywhere in the game. You shouldn't need to wait 3 weeks in between each rank of a skill like Ice Spear, or Crash Shot, etc.

Basically, the revision I proposed would do the following: First, the free rebirthing at age 20 would be removed. However, it would be replaced by the ability to free rebirth when you've reached or passed a designated current level, starting one week from your last rebirth.
The designated current level would be decided from your character's age and its cumulative level at the last rebirth. For example, a brand new total level 1 player might have to reach current level 5 or current level 10 to earn his/her free rebirth, while a total level 3000 character might have to reach current level 80 or 100 or so. I figure that the current level required would begin to lower starting at age 18 and would be pretty much the same for all the ages before that.
For every level you get past that designated level, you might be able to free rebirth a little sooner than a week after your last rebirth(Though this might be set at a cap to prevent abuse of sorts, like a maximum of 2/3 rebirths in a single week, and wouldn't apply to paid rebirths).

[Claudia]

Doesn't sound like a bad idea to me.

[Twiliterror]

Considering how easy it is for some to level, it would be abused to hell and back again.

[Invisible]

Sounds like a wonderful idea.

Too bad it's not profitable.

[Maenad]

Considering how easy it is for some to level, it would be abused to hell and back again.

I find it funny that you call it abuse if a free player can earn a free rebirth through actual work in-game once a week, but the fact that there are people who paid rebirth each week and reach level 80/90/even 100 go unnoticed. Is it really so much different?

Honestly, avid free players that do as much work as, if not more than, paying players shouldn't be left in the dust because they can't afford to pay.

[Justified]

I find it funny that you call it abuse if a free player can earn a free rebirth through actual work in-game once a week, but the fact that there are people who paid rebirth each week and reach level 80/90/even 100 go unnoticed. Is it really so much different?

Honestly, avid free players that do as much work as, if not more than, paying players shouldn't be left in the dust because they can't afford to pay.

All these rebirth 'improvement' ideas (including the other threads) are completely stupid. Any half serious player would never, ever have to pay for rebirths again. Saying that it 'benefits the free players so they don't get left behind' is false, since a lot of these proposals would actually let people level even fast than now, widening the gap on the ones who still think level 100 is an accomplishment.


People always try to nerf the cash shop and, although pay2win isn't really good, there needs to be an actual incentive and benefit for spending real cash. It's what keeps the game going.

[Maenad]

All these rebirth 'improvement' ideas (including the other threads) are completely stupid. Any half serious player would never, ever have to pay for rebirths again. Saying that it 'benefits the free players so they don't get left behind' is false, since a lot of these proposals would actually let people level even fast than now, widening the gap on the ones who still think level 100 is an accomplishment.


People always try to nerf the cash shop and, although pay2win isn't really good, there needs to be an actual incentive and benefit for spending real cash. It's what keeps the game going.

The system would make it so serious players end up needing to get to much higher levels. You think it would be easy getting to level 150 in a week, every week? The more levels you have, the harder it gets. And it does benefit every player because the difficulty scales for them. The system would provide incentives to reach higher and higher levels each rebirth, something the current system doesn't offer.

Also, last I checked, honestly weren't that many rebirth improvement threads. Link me to multiple ones, a single one doesn't count as alot.

[Kenero]

If one were to go by Nexon's wallet then...

Why not make character cards a physical item? When you buy a character card, a character card "capsule" is placed in the item mall. You have to manually withdraw it and use it for it to appear in your account. The character card capsule can also be traded among players and it will even say if it is a special event character card with a bonus item.

Well, that is a good suggestion if you were Nexon and wanted to increase the sale of Character Cards by making it tradable.

[Maenad]

If one were to go by Nexon's wallet then...

Why not make character cards a physical item? When you buy a character card, a character card "capsule" is placed in the item mall. You have to manually withdraw it and use it for it to appear in your account. The character card capsule can also be traded among players and it will even say if it is a special event character card with a bonus item.

Well, that is a good suggestion if you were Nexon and wanted to increase the sale of Character Cards by making it tradable.

It would be fantastic if they decided to do something like that, but as you can see, they've avoided patching in pet trading for quite a while and it does pretty much the same thing, only with pets, and it doesn't rebirth.

[radionoise]

Or, you know, just let free rebirths happen every 2 weeks instead of 3 (paid rb can still be every 6 days) and let people be able to free rebirth at ANY age as long as they've waited the 2 weeks.

[Maenad]

Or, you know, just let free rebirths happen every 2 weeks instead of 3 (paid rb can still be every 6 days) and let people be able to free rebirth at ANY age as long as they've waited the 2 weeks.

That's what someone with no creativity would say D:!

[radionoise]

That's what someone with no creativity would say D:!

Screw creativity, efficiency and being able to play a loli + better stat gain for skillset of your choosing without having to pay is where it's at.

[Sinsie]

In one week, I'm level 73 by honestly dicking around in-game and spent most of my time getting Refine to Rank 1. I just got past total level 400. The rebirth system as it is now seems absolutely perfect and has just the right amount of balance to it that allows players to decide how much it's worth it to speed up their leveling process and how much opportunity Nexon has to rake in the cash. The age thing always seemed like a bummer, but it still makes sense: younger age, more AP. Pay for rebirths, more AP. Wanna be hardcore and really grind the AP fast? You have an answer. Want to grind sorta fast but not be stuck at age 10? You have that as well.

If there was ever going to be any changes, the only one that would seem acceptable is taking away extra AP earned from being a younger age and letting anyone rebirth at any age in three weeks. But ultimately, that would make free rebirthers like me think "hey that's pretty cool" and players dedicated enough to buy nx for maximum growth go "THAT'S SUCH BULL****".

The system works out so well that, unless some absolute moron takes charge and tries to overhaul the system, it will likely never change. Don't fix what isn't broken and such.

[Paradise]

That's what someone with no creativity would say D:!

but its indeed a good idea, that way the lvl gap between paid rb and free rb will be just 2 times instead 3, and it will still give profit to nexon, which is what nexon rly cares.

I have another idea

what about a free 7 days rebirth each 3 rebirths, regardless the rebirth method
but you rebirth at your actual level cut in half> lvl 80 turns lvl 40

[Kendoza]

Or, you know, just let free rebirths happen every 2 weeks instead of 3 (paid rb can still be every 6 days) and let people be able to free rebirth at ANY age as long as they've waited the 2 weeks.

^This is an awesome idea. The whole "wait till age 20" should be thrown out the window.

[Justified]

The system would make it so serious players end up needing to get to much higher levels. You think it would be easy getting to level 150 in a week, every week? The more levels you have, the harder it gets. And it does benefit every player because the difficulty scales for them. The system would provide incentives to reach higher and higher levels each rebirth, something the current system doesn't offer.

Also, last I checked, honestly weren't that many rebirth improvement threads. Link me to multiple ones, a single one doesn't count as alot.

The stupid thing is that it rewards leveling up with the ability to level up even more. If this was implemented, it could've taken me less than a month to get to 3000 on my Elf, instead of sitting at 700 after 3 months. It is incredibly overpowered for people who know how to level effectively, separating them from the people who Fireball Cactus Lizards.

And these threads have always been popping up, it's nothing new. The same similar ideas are always thrown out (Free rebirth in 2 weeks, Free rebirth at a certain level, etc). Not that I ever said there was 'a lot', or that they were all created in a 1 day span.


2-Week rebirth (and/or at any age) actually isn't a terrible idea, but since it would likely ruin the popular 2-1 rebirth cycle I would never want it implemented.

[Hanna]

Dumb idea.
Why? It's extremely abuse-able depending on events and character's skill ranks to be able to easily grind to that x level.
People would be getting weekly rebirths and Nexon would lose money.

There's only one thing that I dislike about the current RB system and that's the Age limit before rbing (20)
I just wish it was 3 weeks in general no matter what age you are.

[Chiyuri]

I posted this in another thread, but I feel like it's interesting enough for its own topic and less of a tweak than a change.

Anyways,
One of the main things making Mabinogi so difficult(Especially for free players) is the amount of time you need to spend to get anywhere in the game. You shouldn't need to wait 3 weeks in between each rank of a skill like Ice Spear, or Crash Shot, etc.

Basically, the revision I proposed would do the following: First, the free rebirthing at age 20 would be removed. However, it would be replaced by the ability to free rebirth when you've reached or passed a designated current level, starting one week from your last rebirth.
The designated current level would be decided from your character's age and its cumulative level at the last rebirth. For example, a brand new total level 1 player might have to reach current level 5 or current level 10 to earn his/her free rebirth, while a total level 3000 character might have to reach current level 80 or 100 or so. I figure that the current level required would begin to lower starting at age 18 and would be pretty much the same for all the ages before that.
For every level you get past that designated level, you might be able to free rebirth a little sooner than a week after your last rebirth(Though this might be set at a cap to prevent abuse of sorts, like a maximum of 2/3 rebirths in a single week, and wouldn't apply to paid rebirths).

That system would make it nearly 5-8 times longuer for me to rebirth... possibly just stop all rebirthing entirely..

[Hanna]

That system would make it nearly 5-8 times longuer for me to rebirth... possibly just stop all rebirthing entirely..

Oh yeah, I forgot about that.

Yeah, what about crafters and merchants?
Are they just shit out of luck?

[Invisible]

Oh yeah, I forgot about that.

Yeah, what about crafters and merchants?
Are they just shit out of luck?


The designated current level would be decided from your character's age and its cumulative level at the last rebirth. For example, a brand new total level 1 player might have to reach current level 5 or current level 10 to earn his/her free rebirth, while a total level 3000 character might have to reach current level 80 or 100 or so.

They can always wait.

[Claudia]

Oh yeah, I forgot about that.

Yeah, what about crafters and merchants?
Are they just shit out of luck?

Leveling on merchant destiny is an absolute joke. For some of us it's like mabi just became easymode.

[Maenad]

I don't even know which 'logic' I should start refuting. There's too much.

Seriously, I can't figure out where to begin, the fact that Justified thinks that his elf can reach total 3000 in 4 weeks with a current 200 cap, the fact that he thinks he can consistently reach it in less than a week to be able to rebirth sooner(Even then, at limit 2 per week that's only 1600 levels, not that anyone could ever do that), the fact that somebody thinks making free players able to rebirth just as fast as paying players actually widens the gap between the two, the fact that some seem to think that being able to actually earn rebirths ingame doing real work ingame is overpowered and that it would be easily abused, the fact that Hanna seems to have forgotten that merchants get crazy EXP with the new destiny... Seriously Mabination, what the hell?

If I had Hoss Delgado's brain implant, the world would be a fiery new star brighter than a nova right about now

@Justified: I have yet to see a screenshot of anyone in NA Mabinogi at the current level cap. If you can show me a screenshot of your elf, that can apparently level so easily, at level 200, as well as getting your character window in the shot so I can see that the time since last rebirth is less than a week, I will believe that you just might be able to do what you said you could do. Gogogo.

[csraln]

i like no age limit

[Justified]

I don't even know which 'logic' I should start refuting. There's too much.

Seriously, I can't figure out where to begin, the fact that Justified thinks that his elf can reach total 3000 in 4 weeks with a current 200 cap, the fact that he thinks he can consistently reach it in less than a week to be able to rebirth sooner(Even then, at limit 2 per week that's only 1600 levels, not that anyone could ever do that)

Or maybe realize what the hell you're even proposing. I can break 100 in a day if I tried, meaning I'm under 1 week rebirth for the first 3000 levels. Ignoring that 2 week limit you just pulled out of your ass like the current level 150 you did on my first post (150 is mentioned nowhere else), you initially said maybe limiting it to 3 rebirths per week, meaning I'd be at least 1200 by the end of the first month, up to 3000 if there is no such restriction.

And really, no system is going to factor in both dynamic formulas, real life timers, and fantasy world timers all into some convoluted system. That's the first sign of a stupid, overly complicated idea that is nowhere near efficient.


the fact that somebody thinks making free players able to rebirth just as fast as paying players actually widens the gap between the two, the fact that some seem to think that being able to actually earn rebirths ingame doing real work ingame is overpowered and that it would be easily abused, the fact that Hanna seems to have forgotten that merchants get crazy EXP with the new destiny... Seriously Mabination, what the hell?

The fact that you don't realize how leveling rewards you with leveling is stupid is even more appalling. That's like getting interest for having gold in your bank, you're getting rewarded for doing nothing except what you're already doing. So basically getting rewarded for doing nothing.

most people who weekly rebirth fall into two categories : those with money to burn who suck anyways, and those who level so rapidly that free rebirth feels like a year to them.
Now add the latter to this enhanced rebirth system, and see how they'd be leveling even faster than those who stop at level 60.

Meanwhile, keep ignoring the fact that you totally destroy rebirth cards with this system, or explain how you're planning on keeping it useful. Because it just sounds like you don't want to use NX, completely ignoring the fact that cash shops are how F2P games are 'F2P'.

[Adrianblade]

I honestly think this has been talked to the ground already and its only been a few days. Basically it looks like a majority of the people like the current rb system for the most part and don't desire any real change to it besides the wait till 20. The current system could be tweaked but it doesn't need a complete overhaul like you are saying. If something works try to make it better sure, but don't make something new and expect it to be better without looking at it from every angle. Also there will always be people that are "left behind". It just makes sense that if you are more powerful you gain things easier then those weaker. Rushing to put everyone on the same level or "catch up" kinda defeats the purpose of playing some games out there.

[Spaghedeity]

It'd reduce nexon's profits. Thus it will never be implemented. And in a way, you don't want it implemented, since if they reduce profits in one section (RB cards) they have to increase them somewhere else (20k nx for a special rb card? more expensive pets?)

[Maenad]

Or maybe realize what the hell you're even proposing. I can break 100 in a day if I tried, meaning I'm under 1 week rebirth for the first 3000 levels. Ignoring that 2 week limit you just pulled out of your ass like the current level 150 you did on my first post



(Though this might be set at a cap to prevent abuse of sorts, like a maximum of 2/3 rebirths in a single week, and wouldn't apply to paid rebirths).

Very last thing stated in original post. Pay attention, smart one. The numbers I gave as current level requirements OBVIOUSLY were not decided. Which levels that would be fair and balanced would have to be decided by someone who runs this shet.

Btw, for being blackrobed on your main for two months, you seem to have gained remarkably less levels on your elf than you would want me to think.

Also, you seem to forget the sheer amount of fashionogers that will gladly fork over ridiculous amounts of NX for anything they want. Mabinogi could run off them alone. And considering NA Mabinogi only has 7 staff the last time I looked...

Honestly, it's like you'd rather not have more high leveled players around.



For future reference:


It'd reduce nexon's profits. Thus it will never be implemented. And in a way, you don't want it implemented, since if they reduce profits in one section (RB cards) they have to increase them somewhere else (20k nx for a special rb card? more expensive pets?)

I never said I thought this would ever get implemented. Never. I was originally going to say(In the OP) "I don't expect this to ever being implemented, it's just thought" but I decided against it.

[Sinsie]

Just because there are other reasons to purchase NX doesn't mean Nexon's going to remove one of its bigger sources of it. Also consider the following: the more prolonged one's destination is towards the 1k-3k or whatever level range is, the more chance there is of that player spending money on the game. If people could powerlevel through the game at a much faster pace than now, they can reach more skills sooner, see more of the game in a shorter period of time, not appreciate what he's gained as much, lose interest in Mabinogi that much faster, pick it back up whenever he's interested.

On the other hand, making the journey take longer means players will experience more events at lower levels, see more new and flashy items, see more content brought into the game, keep enticing them with reasons to play, and introduce a lot more chances to persuade the player to spend money on Mabinogi.

And again, for those who just want to powergame, they can buy rebirth cards every week instead of allowing them to try and exploit a quicker levels for lower-levels system.

Off-topic, but we should try to make things less offensive towards other posters here. There's no harm in discussing what-if scenarios and theories, it won't get implemented anyways so there's no reason to fight for something like this is the only chance it has or try to deny something in the hopes it never sees the light of day.

[Justified]

Very last thing stated in original post. Pay attention, smart one.

(150 is mentioned nowhere else), you initially said maybe limiting it to 3 rebirths per week)

Or you can pay attention.


Btw, for being blackrobed on your main for two months, you seem to have gained remarkably less levels on your elf than you would want me to think.

instead of sitting at 700 after 3 months.

I'm totally the one who can't read, and I'm totally trying to mislead you. Totally.
Also implying I actually like playing my elf, and not just using it to keep in touch with my guild.


The numbers I gave as current level requirements OBVIOUSLY were not decided. Which levels that would be fair and balanced would have to be decided by someone who runs this shet.

Then don't propose random numbers and expect people not to interpret them.


Also, you seem to forget the sheer amount of fashionogers that will gladly fork over ridiculous amounts of NX for anything they want. Mabinogi could run off them alone. And considering NA Mabinogi only has 7 staff the last time I looked...

So now you want more overpowered Gachapon items? Because TW Mabi balance is totally not destroyed by the Cash Shop, we should really make NA divert their attention away from Rebirth cards.



Honestly, it's like you'd rather not have more high leveled players around.

I could care less how many high levels there are. I want skilled players who know what they're doing, not people who have only commerce'd for their entire life, asking for other people to carry them through dungeons all the time.


I never said I thought this would ever get implemented. Never. I was originally going to say(In the OP) "I don't expect this to ever being implemented, it's just thought" but I decided against it.

Saying something will never be implemented doesn't magically stop it from being a terrible idea, or make any counterarguments irrelevant. It's still a terrible idea.

[Taycat]

Araria, seriously. Take a chill pill and stop attacking other members. Please, I am asking you as a fellow member, it doesn't make the site look good when it's members are constantly arguing at each other over petty things such as levels and rebirths.

[Maenad]

I think you might be mad because honestly, this does not qualify as a terrible idea. It has obvious benefits, and it has its flaws. Stop shooting random accusations at me. I didn't say I wanted more OP cash shop items, ever. Stop trying to make me look bad just because I'm arguing with you.



Araria, seriously. Take a chill pill and stop attacking other members. Please, I am asking you as a fellow member, it doesn't make the site look good when it's members are constantly arguing at each other over petty things such as levels and rebirths.

He's the one spouting hyperboles.

[Darkboy132]

I'd prefer if they lowered AP costs...

I'm sorry to say but its abusable considering people can get to 70 in one day thanks to Commerce.

[Taycat]

Araria, no, stop bating and just leave it. It doesn't help when you don't stop. It takes someone who knows that fighting is senseless to end a fight. I understand this might seem a little backseat modding, but I am begging that you stop fighting and get over these things.

I mean, really, you're arguing over LEVELING in a VIDEO GAME.

[Jyu Viole Grace]

I really don't understand why people take these thread so seriously. It's as if what Araria is saying is going to come true 100%. I think some of you should re-read the title of the thread and realise that it's just a suggestion, and if you don't like these threads (or don't like the ideas in the thread) don't post in them. (looking at certain people here.)



On topic: I think they should just keep the age 20 free rebirth thing because some people like me, who like to take breaks from mabi at certain times wouldn't be able to rebirth for a long time. I mean like I get to level 40-50 and I wouldn't want to get past that each time because I'm THAT lazy.

[Justified]

I think you might be mad because honestly, this does not qualify as a terrible idea. It has obvious benefits, and it has its flaws. Stop shooting random accusations at me. I didn't say I wanted more OP cash shop items, ever. Stop trying to make me look bad just because I'm arguing with you.

And I'm just staying why the flaws massively outweigh the benefits.
And I asked you like 3 times how you plan on keeping Rebirth Cards alive, which you shrugged onto Fashionogi. Gachapons, including the ones with overpowered items, are a perfect example of what you're pushing the problem on to. So you're blaming me because you're ignoring the implications of a half-baked idea.


I really don't understand why people take these thread so seriously. It's as if what Araria is saying is going to come true 100%. I think some of you should re-read the title of the thread and realise that it's just a suggestion, and if you don't like these threads don't post in them. (looking at certain people here.)

As I said before, just being a suggestion doesn't make it suddenly immune to being stupid.
And I don't post in threads I don't like. This one is particularly amusing.

There's no rule stating that every post has to be in support of an idea. That would be pointless.

[Ithiliel]

Wow, ok. There's so many things wrong in this thread currently, that honestly leaving it open will just cause further fighting.

Araria and Justified- The cattiness and rudeness from both of you is unneeded, and if either of you can't back up your own reasoning WITHOUT insulting the other, you should just step away. Accusing each other doesn't help either of you look any better as well.

Mythical Detective Loki- Honey, next time just report so you don't get in trouble for backseat modding, alright?