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Thread: New weapon, skills, items, and tweaks you'd like to see!~

  1. #3791
    King of Ruin koishi-sempai has tamed a desert dragon koishi-sempai has tamed a desert dragon koishi-sempai has tamed a desert dragon koishi-sempai has tamed a desert dragon koishi-sempai has tamed a desert dragon koishi-sempai has tamed a desert dragon koishi-sempai has tamed a desert dragon koishi-sempai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zekkii View Post
    Mage:
    Why not just nerf firebolt instead?
    Firebolt's problem isn't damage though, it's essentially having all the strengths of Magnum Shot, significantly less endgame damage (compared to better midgame and early though most new players can't really sustain firebolt spam), and none of range's weaknesses, and most of its damage loaded into a single mastery where other players need to invest in enchants and reforges.

    Let's try something different.

    Magic Weapon Mastery Bolt Damage reduced to 50%, except when using Fusion Bolt.
    Magic Weapon Mastery Bolt Damage when using Fusion Bolt is 100%.
    Firebolt Range reduced to 1000 with all weapons.
    Firebolt now stuns instead of knocks back.
    Firebolt base damage reduced to 100 at R1.
    Firebolt Mana Use increased to 20 per charge. CC+4 increases base mana cost by 6.5x.
    Magic Bonuses now increase damage in a multiplicative fashion.
    Magic Attack Coefficient increased to .5~1.25
    Magic Weapon Mastery imposes a 1 - ([Int / 300] / 10) second cooldown on all Chaincasted Magic Bolts, except Fusion Bolt.
    Hebona Set Effect increased to 15% from 10%

    This fixes several things about Firebolt's mechanics (the excessive safety, relatively low cost and spammability) while allowing its (and Magic as a whole) to scale similarly to other talents, while rewarding the player for investing in MATK, Reforges and other specializations for the skillset (and fixes the problematic interaction between Max Damage and Firebolt DPS, though it doesn't address Overture but Overture should be nerfed/gutted/deleted to begin with). It also imposes severe mana costs that require investment or extra time spent potion making to mitigate. And by lowering the range, it really encourages the use of Spellwalk...except you're going to be using a lot more mana.

    Pretty much, after a lot of gear and stat investment, Firebolt is a tad stronger than now (more damage but less safe and spammable), while midgame Firebolt is pretty clunky and early game Firebolt is pretty bad. This also doesn't kill Firebolt's single target potential, just forces you to invest heavily in it statwise and gear wise.

    Also Crisis is the problem with Puppeteer, Climatic is balanced. I'd delete Crisis, buff Act 7, 9 and 4. Maybe have a means of CD reduction for using other puppet skills? This would make the skillset more interactive and less "spam crisis to nuke". It also kills Blaze as a dominant strategy, and we know how toxic Blaze is (terrible concept, terrible design, terrible balance, either op or useless, why does this skill exist, it doesn't even feel magey, oh my god i fucking hate blaze oh my god kill it kill it). Hailstorm probably doesn't need Crisis anymore with the QOL buffs, at most a slight reduction in full charge time, or make it scale iwth Int like the base load time.
    Last edited by koishi-sempai; 02-02-2015 at 05:15 PM.
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  2. #3792
    The Great Owl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkboy132 View Post
    I've always wondered if its reduced Effective Protection (the new Enlightenment value thingy) or Protection Stat (the stat listed in the character stat window)...

    Lightning Rod is 200% full charge bonus at rank 1.

    Might be too harsh of a nerf. EW FB is still chance-based, and as Zeo said not spammable and certain mobs are immune to it.
    Piercing reduces protection, not damage reduction. That's why it makes little difference versus enemies like the white dragon.

    Lightning Rod is +200% damage at Rank 1 (ie 300% damage). If you remember, it used to say 100% full charge bonus before it hit live server. This means the skill has an effective magic attack coefficient of 36...the highest of any spell. Pretty absurd for a 15 second cooldown and paltry load time.

    While some targets may be immune to Frozen Wave, the overwhelming majority are not (compare to reforges). With a hurricane cylinder you can send the freeze duration up to 50~60 seconds, which is very scary when you're looking at a skill with an effective freeze rate of 100%. That gives you plenty of time to fill up the marbles, unleash pain, and use it again as targets unfreeze. That being said it doesn't see much usage. I suppose it's best left alone unless that changes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zekkii View Post
    Mage:
    Why not just nerf firebolt instead?

    Gunslinger:
    Personally I probably wouldn't use guns if shooting rush size was nerfed

    Fighter:
    New respite completely cancels out the minus from mana recovery

    Puppeteer:
    This one I really don't get, Climactic Crash is overrated, personally I don't use it in the current version

    Everything else seems fine to me.
    That was the intent. Perhaps raising Firebolt's load time or charge multiplier would be a better solution.

    Respite's aftereffect still punishes magic/alchemy. Oh, wait. Fair enough. I suppose switching weapon shouldn't cancel respite.
    -50% HP +50% MP
    +50% HP +50% SP
    -75% HP, +25% MP

    Climactic Crash is extremely powerful and still sees high usage in certain areas. In retrospect, I would drop it to 500% (per hit) and monitor usage.


  3. #3793
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slayerj View Post
    Firebolt: 1.3 second charge time.
    now ignores 5 magic defense and at rank 1 ignores 1 magic protection.
    Lowering its casting time even further and making it ignore magic defensive stats is unnecessary.

    Gunner: Shooting rush and bullet storm cooldowns increased by a few seconds each. (2-4 maybe 5, nothing too major.)
    Shooting Rush yes, Bullet Storm needs the reverse.

    Crissis will not pull mobs using defense with a shield (neither will wirepull) and those without a shield using defense will take reduced dmg.
    Why should it require a shield to negate pull?

    Crash can now be blocked by a mob using a shield to defend only, BUT it will still be pushed back and hit by additional hits. This effectively reduces the dmg a good amount.
    Already does that. Defense not cancelling against skills that aren't blockable is a glitch, according to Tasket. Crash just needs a nerf to its base damage

    Act 1 will now ignore 1 to 20 defense at rank F to 5, and ignore 21-25 defense and 1 - 5 protection at ranks 4 to 1. It still hits through defense unless the target has a shield. At which point the target will take reduced dmg and not be knocked back unless put into deadly status.

    The problem with a few of the skills in this game is that they ignore things like defense. Like, a LOT of skills just flat out ignore something that ALMOST EVERY monster in the game has. Things were never updated to fit well with newer content. At least with some skills defense can actually do something against it, but that is not the case for a number of skills.
    There's actually very few that have defense ignore: Stomp (which is extremely weak to begin with), some Demigod, and some damage over times. Adding in more defense piercing to everything is unnecessary and potentially leads to power creeps. That's one of the major reasons why Lances are broken.

    Quote Originally Posted by koishi-sempai View Post
    Firebolt now stuns instead of knocks back.
    That's actually going to cripple newbs and take away the one thing that can bostler a newb mage's survival. Also decreases bolt diversity.

    Back then Fire Counter was pretty much the only thing that could combat Mana Deflector mobs. If you take the knockback away and then send a skilled but weak/frail person with only newb skills to Barri Normal against the Ogre Warriors, chances are they won't survive.

    Firebolt Mana Use increased to 20 per charge. CC+4 increases base mana cost by 6.5x.
    Too high, especially when coupled with all the nerfs you suggested. I'd rather they up it to 10 but no more past that.

    Also Crisis is the problem with Puppeteer, Climatic is balanced. I'd delete Crisis, buff Act 7, 9 and 4. Maybe have a means of CD reduction for using other puppet skills?
    Crisis is not a major player; it's the skills that utilize it that are absurd. Deleting Crisis would just make Puppetry even harder to use.

    And how is Climactic Crash balanced? 550% x 3 = 1650% is way too powerful.

    There already is a CD reduction: Control Marionette.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaeporo
    While some targets may be immune to Frozen Wave, the overwhelming majority are not (compare to reforges). With a hurricane cylinder you can send the freeze duration up to 50~60 seconds, which is very scary when you're looking at a skill with an effective freeze rate of 100%. That gives you plenty of time to fill up the marbles, unleash pain, and use it again as targets unfreeze. That being said it doesn't see much usage. I suppose it's best left alone unless that changes.
    What... then that Cylinder needs a nerf, maybe?
    Last edited by Darkboy132; 02-02-2015 at 06:36 PM.

  4. #3794
    Formerly known as Psy
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    People please keep in mind the purpose of Magic Weapon Mastery. Bolt mages were opting for non-wand/staff choices for bolts because the minuscule amount of damage most magic weapons provided was not worth the durability loss rate/repair fee that they yield. Magic Weapon Mastery made using nonchaincast bolts with a wand not be a complete waste of money. Before enlightenment, even though I had a magic weapon equipped, I specifically switched to the weapon tab without the magic weapon to use bolts because it was just a pointless waste of durability to use it with the magic weapon.

  5. #3795
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kapra View Post
    People please keep in mind the purpose of Magic Weapon Mastery. Bolt mages were opting for non-wand/staff choices for bolts because the minuscule amount of damage most magic weapons provided was not worth the durability loss rate/repair fee that they yield. Magic Weapon Mastery made using nonchaincast bolts with a wand not be a complete waste of money. Before enlightenment, even though I had a magic weapon equipped, I specifically switched to the weapon tab without the magic weapon to use bolts because it was just a pointless waste of durability to use it with the magic weapon.
    How about this?

    Magic Mastery
    No changes.

    Fire/Ice/Lightning Mastery
    No changes.


    Icebolt
    M.Atk Coefficient (min) raised to 0.7
    M.Atk Coefficient (max) raised to 0.8


    Firebolt
    M.Atk Coefficient (min) raised to 0.6
    M.Atk Coefficient (max) raised to 0.9
    Load Time raised to 2 seconds

    Lightning Bolt
    M.Atk Coefficient (max) raised to 1.5

    Bolt Mastery
    Bolt Magic Damage +50%

    Magic Weapon Mastery
    Bolt Magic Damage +25%
    Int Magic Casting Time -15%
    Adv Magic Radius +10%

    Fusion Bolt
    Fused Bolt Damage +30%

    ---

    This would slightly hinder Firebolt while simultaneously balancing out bolt magic power distribution between skills and increasing the value of the Hebona Set Effect.


  6. #3796
    Formerly known as Psy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaeporo View Post
    This would slightly hinder Firebolt while simultaneously balancing out bolt magic power distribution between skills and increasing the value of the Hebona Set Effect.
    True, that solves that, but it doesn't address the utility of using a wand/staff for bolts rather than just going weaponless for it. Most magic weapons don't have high magic attack or int to benefit from having them equipped.

    If I had it my way, way back in Enlightenment, instead of them adding Magic Weapon Mastery, I would make Bolt Mastery give a significantly higher bonus that only applied when equipped with a Wand/Staff, rather than bare handed or with other weapons.

    And I don't really think we need incentive to use a Magic Weapon for Advanced Magic, it's not like it's possible to use one without one. I kind of already think Magic Weapon Mastery's Intermediate Magic bonuses are pointless, and should've been attributed to other sources.

  7. #3797
    Mabination User DefinitelyNotTwin has just left the soul stream
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    Teemo can no longer blind Lee.

    Wait wrong game

    Using singing to often will put the user in sore throat status :D


    If fitting in means doing wrong,I rather be a outcast. I'm always glad having true people with meh :D

  8. #3798
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    Quote Originally Posted by DefinitelyNotTwin View Post
    Teemo can no longer blind Lee.

    Wait wrong game

    Using singing to often will put the user in sore throat status :D
    What...

    Enthralling Performance:
    • Music Bottles and Microphones can now be used at Rank Novice.
    • Cello may now be used at Rank 9.
    • Bass Drum and Piano may now be used at Rank 5.
    • Stamina use decreased 6.67 /sec -> 2 /sec
    • CP limit raised 4.7k -> 10k
    • Lure target amount cap raised 7 -> 12.
    • Duration increased 45 sec -> 90 sec
    • Rate of luring is now based on how long EP has been in use; every 1 second will lure in +500 CP enemies at Rank N/F and +1k CP enemies at Rank 1. So, it will take 20-10 seconds to lure an enemy with 10k CP.
    • Lured targets will head toward the player instead of following each other in order in a straight line. The way they move right now makes them very easy to get stuck.
    • Animal NPCs (e.g. Sheep) can now be lured.
    • At Rank 5, the lurer and the lured can run.
    • Skill immune monsters (immune to Shadow Bind, Frozen Blast, etc.) are no longer affected by Enthralling Performance.

    • Taunt no longer has a lure target amount cap. 5 enemies is a very very small amount.
    • Crisis and Lullaby no longer targets skill immune monsters.
    Last edited by Darkboy132; 02-03-2015 at 04:43 AM.

  9. #3799
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    This may seem like a radical change. Unlike my Spirit Weapon/Upgrading post, almost all the details of this are from me and not others I interviewed. However I have known many people to quit Mabinogi because of the issue of racial imbalance and I consider it a more pressing issue than Spirit Weapons.

    Racial Consolidation
    • Content-wise, not story-wise, there is no longer races.
    • There is now two body types. Standard and Large.
      • Standard body type is that of a Human/Elf. Large is that of a giant.
      • Customization options that were previously Elf-only can now be used by Standard Body Type characters who were previously Human and vice versa.
      • Customization options that previously could only be used by Humans/Elves now have Large Body Type Counterparts, as well as previously Giant-only options available to Standard Body Types. (If you want to be a giant with elf ears, I don't really care but you can like this.)
      • All clothing should ideally be compatible with both body types. If there are any Giant-only clothing right now with no Human or Elf counterparts, Standard Body Type counterparts should be made and vice versa.
    • Age up AP is reduced to 1 at all ages.
    • Age is no longer a requirement for quests (raids, belvast dailies) or ideal types.
    • Equipment are no longer age locked or race/body type locked.
    • Age up stats are no longer a thing. A newly created 17 year old will have the same stat as a newly created 10 year old.
    • Level up stats, excluding talent exclusive level up stat bonuses, are now standardized to no longer be different with race or age.
      • Giants get .75 will per level up at age 11-16 except they get 1.00 will at lvl 15. Humans only get 1.00 HP when leveling at age 10 and 11. Now it's going to be the same across the board, regardless of age or race/bodytype.
    • New Skill: Agility Mastery
      • Trained similar to a book skill.
      • This skill increases base running speed. And at higher ranks, allows you to run with certain archery skills and allows you to use some archery skills on the back of mounts.
      • Skill is capped at rank 6.
      • Existing Elves before this update will automatically have this skill at rank 6.
      • Existing Giants before this update will automatically have this skill at rank A.
      • Existing Humans before this update will automatically have this skill at rank F.
      • New characters regardless of body type will automatically have this skill at rank F, like how they start with Combat Mastery.
    • New Skill: Weight Endurance
      • Trained similar to a book skill, only doesn't use books.
      • At r1, you can use Charge without a shield, equip a shield with a Two Handed Sword, Dual Wield Swords and Blunt Weapons, etc.
      • Existing Giants before this update will automatically have this skill at rank 1.
      • Existing Humans before this update will automatically have this skill at some rank, F<x<1, idc which.
      • Existing Elves before this update will automatically have this skill at rank F.
    • Since races no longer exist, both body types may now use both Bows and Lances, and use their respective skillsets.
    • All skills with racial differences are buffed to the best version for all body types.
      • Lightning Bolt for example uses 5 MP for Giants, 4 for Elves, and 3.5 for Humans, and costs 122 AP for Humans/Giants and 152 for Elves. Same int around the board. Now, the charge time is 3.5 for all body types, and previous elves get refunded the 30 extra AP they spent.
    • Previously racial exclusive skills such as Final Hit, Stomp, Mirage Missile, are now available to all body types.
    • Everyone now gets Paladin at G2 instead of Savage Beast/Falcon.
    • Stats of Falcon and Savage Beast merged.
      • Savage Beast has 800 HP, 12 min damage, and 18 max damage. Falcon has 500 HP, 15 min damage, 30 max damage. New stats for both are not 800 HP, 15 min damage, 30 max damage, etc.
    • Falcon/Savage Beast quest chain readded and blended, everyone gets Beast (hey, right now ingame its called Beast tab whether you're an Elf or Giant) from doing this chain.
    • Paladin/Dark Knight models added to Large Body Type.
    • Both body types may become a Paladin after G2, a Dark Knight after G3S4, or a Beast after the Beast quest. When you unlock a new transformation you are asked if you wish to keep the current transformation or switch to the one you just got.
    • All three transformations have Control Over Darkness, Elven Magic Missile, and Giant Full Swing now. Just rename them all so their names aren't weird. It's not like we have an excess of transformation skills.
    • You can pay NX to switch Body Types and/or Transformation types during rebirth (similar to switching sex).
    • Balance talent exp somehow, I'm not going to go over that shit.
    • Support cards need to be removed already. This started out as an old event and outstayed its welcome.
    • Any account that has fewer than 6 characters/character cards will get the amount of character cards they lack. (New accounts start with 6 character cards right now if you didn't know.)
    • Elf Vs Giant PvP is replaced with Red Vs Blue PvP. You can switch between Red/Blue once every ingame day.
    • Hide is obtained by some quest now. You decide how to balance the quest.
    • Everyone can use Quivers from the start.

    As I said, people have quit over races. Feel free to disagree but to me, mabi has always been a game about many possibilities, and being able to take on so many things but specialize in one, and always come back and specialize in other things given enough effort and time. G5 (or Pioneers of Iria for NA, or Uncharted Lands for EU) changed that by adding Elves/Races. Don't get me wrong, I love the way Elves look and their backstory, but I consider it a bad decision. In fact, in Korea in G13 they release Destinies. Not the Destiny system we knew, that Destiny system had restrictions, and the korean player base was in outrage. So DevCAT responded by releasing a different form of Destinies, which is what NA got in G13. If you ask me, Races were much more restrictive than Destinies were. If Races came out in G13 instead of G5, I'm sure there would be outrage. The purpose of races in other games are to have an excuse of making more than one character (MapleStory). That doesn't really work out well in a game like Mabinogi where the idea is to potentially become a jack of all trades and spend years developing just one character.

    Bring in the support and hate, please.

  10. #3800
    The Great Owl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kapra View Post
    This may seem like a radical change. Unlike my Spirit Weapon/Upgrading post, almost all the details of this are from me and not others I interviewed. However I have known many people to quit Mabinogi because of the issue of racial imbalance and I consider it a more pressing issue than Spirit Weapons.

    Racial ConsolidationAs I said, people have quit over races. Feel free to disagree but to me, mabi has always been a game about many possibilities, and being able to take on so many things but specialize in one, and always come back and specialize in other things given enough effort and time. G5 (or Pioneers of Iria for NA, or Uncharted Lands for EU) changed that by adding Elves/Races. Don't get me wrong, I love the way Elves look and their backstory, but I consider it a bad decision. In fact, in Korea in G13 they release Destinies. Not the Destiny system we knew, that Destiny system had restrictions, and the korean player base was in outrage. So DevCAT responded by releasing a different form of Destinies, which is what NA got in G13. If you ask me, Races were much more restrictive than Destinies were. If Races came out in G13 instead of G5, I'm sure there would be outrage. The purpose of races in other games are to have an excuse of making more than one character (MapleStory). That doesn't really work out well in a game like Mabinogi where the idea is to potentially become a jack of all trades and spend years developing just one character.

    Bring in the support and hate, please.
    I love the idea behind races and i'm totally on-board with the "separate but equal" treatment in Mabinogi. Unfortunately, DevCat has proven time and again that they're really fucking bad at solving simple design issues. I mean, how do you develop Giants as THE crowing melee race and then release the renovation update, which "slightly" buffs one Giant-only skill (did you forget about Wind Guard and Taunt, DevCat?) and massively buffs Final Hit, a Human-only skill.

    At this point, I wouldn't be opposed to a simple race-merge. The key design philosophy behind the move would be "Keep it Simple, Stupid".


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