Still not a complete test done, as if you wanted to recreate the scenario where you would ideally be using FH along with Firebolt, then you would be using a max damage set. In that case, no, it's not that clear. You compared how much damage you lose with the switch of titles from having no gear, which clearly won't be the case with relevant firebolt and FH users. All you showed was the damage difference between max damage additive and MA additive with no other condition, with the titles not really being the same calibre (Meteor Strike Master ALO Asuna vs. Whatever you used 26 max damage, which we know is not the best max damage title you're using. If you're using titles to compare, at least use the best of each category).
Originally Posted by kuronogami
People really shouldn't be replying "oh, but I firebolt with no gear!" We're talking about relevant firebolt damage and uses. People with no relevant gear (regardless of if your focus is on MA or Max) simply won't do much firebolt damage and this is a no brainer. I'm not calling for end game max damage gears like mine, but I am calling for a relevant test, where we can expect most players to have some conditions. That includes basic enchants like Encore Camo, Solo Camo, Dexterity, etc. These enchants are not hard to get, even for lazy players.
The chip bonus is 1.2, first added to the character damage that you see, but then it also amplifies the BFO by 1.2, so it's not BFO + chip as you have it there. The damage that you'd see amplified is max damage bonus * 1.2 * BFO * 1.2.
Originally Posted by koishi-sempai
Last edited by ironwoman; 06-21-2016 at 05:08 PM.
Max from strength = nothing
Originally Posted by kuronogami
So that's thrown out to begin with unless you're using BFO, then that's a max * BFO% * .4
Matk is always 2 matk = 1 firebolt damage.
End coeff with heb/circ/ALO is 6.5 * (1 + .15(fire) + .15(bolt) + 1.5(MWM) + .15(Hebona) + .2(Bolt mastery) + .02(ALO)) = 3.17 * 6.5 = 20.605 multiplier.
With just masteries it ends up being 2.8. Most people don't get much past 3.0 because making a heb set gimps you in some ways. Attack speed enhance is a pain, can't use the fancy new pierce robe or g20 sets. Only options are getting mana reduction with karis+enchants or using langu armor+enchants for attack increase. Which ends up gimping your damage further(Hawk and Baron aren't the best enchants for damage).
Anyways. It ends up being that 2.5 enchant damage = 18~20 firebolt damage, and 2 matk = 18~20 firebolt damage. Your maximum amount of matk in a set is ~60 and gimps your max damage to hell. A solid max damage set runs around 100. This is 30 vs 40. Simple math in the end, and remember that max damage enchants echo the BFO so add in for a standard 40% a bonus 16 firebolt max from the additional 40 max. 30 vs 56.
Matk enchants really only matter if you're doing LR or Blaze, as neither benefit from BFO/max damage. So 9/10 using just your max damage gear does wonders for firebolt. If you're a nutcase like me you specialize in this and are built to abuse it to the limit(heb set, Viv reforges, Mana reduction set effect, etc.)
In NA there is no way in seventh hell while FH is up that you as a firebolter can match that. I've tried, I've done the math, I've even used Rynn's stupid good firebolts under similar conditions w/o BFO and w/ Viv. You just can't match it and in cases where brio shear is involved(BD, Duke) its just not able to keep up. However from the downtime of ~50 seconds, your firebolt wont actually stop. Additionally, FH/Bash outdo firebolt in boss situatons, but are rather lackluster in most shadow mission/extended battle situations. See: Brio shear. KR doesn't have that much of a disparity, but brio shear turnabout still exists and so long as the situation isn't hazardous for FH(ADV HS gimmicky bullshit, High damage reduction, massive amounts of walking), FH>Firebolt in a good portion of relevant content. Rabbie Phantasm is dangerous enough that Master of Spellwalk is considered a good idea and FH is probably suicide.
I did a garbageload of theorycrafting, refining the process, the works, Rynn's thread did wonders to help. My main point is that unless you're using BFO the ego's average damage is still higher or equal to a step6 tribolt, and likely gives a step7 a run for its money. Viv Reforges are stupid broken even in NA. They're worse in KR.
TL;DR: In most circumstances you're better of with max damage and max damage titles. Limit Breaker/Merlin(or the fancy new free title) if you're REALLY in need of that dank matk, otherwise go damage or go bard/utility like I do. I'm a professional elf scum firebolter and my 2nd title is almost always ALO Asuna or starlet, and my main title cycles between BFO/Viv/Maestro/Snap Cast Master/Spellwalk Master/Hydra Master. I haven't touched Blood master in months, I don't get Girg Slayer because VHM might as well be anti-elf, and Limit breaker is a waste of a heroic stone for me. I don't even have Meteor Strike Master as I'll likely never really use it.
I already know someone who has a full vivace set who'll most likely be running with quite frequently. I'm not really worried about being utility. I'm just trying to figure out what things will optimize damage the best.
Originally Posted by Esileruf
I wasn't trying to combat final hit. I was trying to see how much I would potentially loose in damage by using max titles (so that I could final hit while firebolting).
My next focus will probably be bolt master vs meteor master.