A Study On Secondary Weapons

• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-12-21 02:06

  Quote from Narc;254906:

  But by your philosophy, I'd have killed the boss way before you'd kill it using chain hooks. If a boss requires one person to constantly chain (assuming you'd have 4 people), you wouldn't be able to maximize damage done. With 4 people on one boss, its a simple matter of keeping the boss stunned continuously and that's not a problem with smashes, etc, and sometimes you wouldn't even need to throw a single spear. But then again that'd be assuming everyone was good at the game.
  
  I'm not saying it doesn't has it uses though, its merely a matter of opinion.

  
  
  Raid bosses let 6 players through.
  
  And a raid boss running around with 6 players trying to hit it?
  
  Or
  
  A raid boss that cannot move or attack with 4 players trying to hit it.
  
  Most normal bosses of course go down with 1 hook, so thats nice too.
  
  Yes, hooks are a party weapon. I dare not bring hooks when I solo or duo. Waste of effort and money.
• Narc wrote on 2010-12-21 02:31

  Quote from Cucurbita;254911:

  Raid bosses let 6 players through.
  
  And a raid boss running around with 6 players trying to hit it?
  
  Or
  
  A raid boss that cannot move or attack with 4 players trying to hit it.
  
  Most normal bosses of course go down with 1 hook, so thats nice too.
  
  Yes, hooks are a party weapon. I dare not bring hooks when I solo or duo. Waste of effort and money.

  
  
  I probably haven't ever had a party over 4, if i do party with randoms, so forgive me if I'm wrong.
  The only raid bosses i know of are the polar bears (i haven't messed around on boat 4 yet, and I'm not sure if other bosses count).
  
  6 players with 42 spears (hard) seems more than enough to me, but of course, you wouldn't be able to guess perfectly where the boss lands, and stun doesn't happen, et cetera, there within where the problem lies.
  I guess it's more of a cautious approach, and varies greatly with the amount of party members you have.
  
  I'd do some actual calculations if I it mattered that much though.
  it's fun to watch bosses flip upside down in upward positions though, I'll admit.
• Kueh wrote on 2010-12-21 02:37
  42/7=6 knockdowns.
  
  If everyone brought hooks, it'd be like 25 knockdowns.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-12-21 02:42

  Quote from Whyrainfalls;254961:

  42/7=6 knockdowns.
  
  If everyone brought hooks, it'd be like 25 knockdowns.

  
  
  Don't forget, hook lock lasts twice as long as spear lock.
• Narc wrote on 2010-12-21 02:52

  Quote from Whyrainfalls;254961:

  42/7=6 knockdowns.
  
  If everyone brought hooks, it'd be like 25 knockdowns.

  
  
  And bosses take 7 spears to knock down?
  And I'm pretty sure a mix of hooks and spears would be better than all hooks, but you were just illustrating your point of how many hooks you could bring.
  
  My theory is that using spears will let you beat a boss faster than hooks ever could, relying on spear's knockdown isn't necessarily a priority.
• Kueh wrote on 2010-12-21 02:54

  Quote from Narc;254998:

  My theory is that using spears will let you beat a boss faster than hooks ever could, relying on spear's knockdown isn't necessarily a priority.

  
  
  But that theory is wrong. If you have the boss down permaKD with hooks, it doesn't matter that one person isn't attacking, because the other three are attacking non-stop.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-12-21 02:56

  Quote from Narc;254998:

  And bosses take 7 spears to knock down?
  And I'm pretty sure a mix of hooks and spears would be better than all hooks, but you were just illustrating your point of how many hooks you could bring.
  
  My theory is that using spears will let you beat a boss faster than hooks ever could, relying on spear's knockdown isn't necessarily a priority.

  
  
  Of course secondary weapons are completely unnecessary. It just helps a lot and speeds things up.
  And of course I never said everyone should bring chain hooks.
  
  But yes, to respond, it takes 6 spears to bring down a polar bear. 7 to knock down a giant spider.
  And I believe well over 10 to get a Rhagodessa. I know its more for Red Tyrant.
  
  Chain hooks are always fixed at 2 for large bosses, 1 for small bosses.
  
  Spear Locking is definitely more effective than hooks in a White Tyrant raid and Hidden raid, but in Blood Lord or Red Tyrant raid, you'd be doing your team a GREAT favor by bringing chain hooks with one buddy.
  
  Though I don't know about the extra large ones like Titan. Can you even hook those? Flash bangs might be better.
• Kueh wrote on 2010-12-21 03:01
  I like to bang large beings.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-12-21 03:07
  Flash bang is really nice since its a short guaranteed stun, but you can only hold 3 QQ
• Narc wrote on 2010-12-21 03:07

  Quote from Whyrainfalls;255006:

  But that theory is wrong. If you have the boss down permaKD with hooks, it doesn't matter that one person isn't attacking, because the other three are attacking non-stop.

  
  
  If you got the boss on repeated knockdowns with regular stuns without hooks, you'd be about 27% as efficient.
  
  
  but I'll let it go. I did say hook had they're uses, in my defense.
  I still prefer blocking/dodging because in my elitist mind, it requires more 'skill'.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-12-21 03:13

  Quote from Narc;255028:

  
  I still prefer blocking/dodging because in my elitist mind, it requires more 'skill'.

  
  
  Well that makes ALL secondary weapons kinda moot (except mine bombs) since they mostly exist for locking the boss.
  Spear lock, bomb lock, flash lock, hook lock.
  
  I usually DO hold spears though, since they have the most use overall.
  
  I find myself carrying a ton of bombs lately because I have toad genocide to initiate... and they have so much hp.