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Cucurbita wrote on 2010-11-13 00:33
Quote from Andy-Buddy;213410:
There are only 3~ Hammer Skills out right now, so I see no point in really having to make this decision.
Mostly I see this as a situational thing, and since the Hammer Skills have no physical difference, (As in an additional attack, less stamina use, etc.) then I'd just rank Sword Skills where your AP makes a difference. Hammer does fine with skills at rank F. (Except for Mastery.)
Two.
Stigma and Buttefly.
Sword have three.
Blossom, Ivy Sweep, and Amaranth.
I'm not sure what you're talking about though. Ap makes more difference on hammer since hammer base damage is stronger and skills increase the damage by a percentile.
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Andy-Buddy wrote on 2010-11-13 00:35
Quote from Cucurbita;213414:
Two.
Stigma and Buttefly.
Sword have three.
Blossom, Ivy Sweep, and Amaranth.
I'm not sure what you're talking about though. Ap makes more difference on hammer since hammer base damage is stronger and skills increase the damage by a percentile.
I was referring to how with the three (I included Long Hammer Mastery) hammer skills don't gain a new active ability, unlike how 2/3 of the sword skills gain an extra attack.
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December wrote on 2010-11-13 00:38
Is a hybrid Fiona plausible at all? I tend to use swords on faster bosses, hammers on slower or when the party is like 4 people. Meanwhile maxing skills that will benefit both opposed to masteries, so far its working out pretty well.
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Cucurbita wrote on 2010-11-13 00:39
Quote from Andy-Buddy;213418:
I was referring to how with the three (I included Long Hammer Mastery) hammer skills don't gain a new active ability, unlike how 2/3 of the sword skills gain an extra attack.
Ivy Sweep's extra attack just makes up for how amazingly awesome Butterfly deals with aoe.
Blossom's 3rd hit is kinda meh. Its really good up to the 2nd hit. If you have enough time in your combo string for a 3rd blossom you probably had enough time to just go straight into an amaranth.
Hammer skills start out awesome to begin with, with secondary abilities like being able to charge up or use consecutively.
Quote from December;213422:
Is a hybrid Fiona plausible at all? I tend to use swords on faster bosses, hammers on slower or when the party is like 4 people. Meanwhile maxing skills that will benefit both opposed to masteries, so far its working out pretty well.
Yeah but it'll cost a lot of AP...
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risend wrote on 2010-11-13 01:56
Didn't hammers also get a buff in the Korean version in terms of speed and attack power recently? Or did we get that already ahead of time?
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Kuchibashi wrote on 2010-11-13 15:27
Pretty sure we already have those hardcoded buffs and any of the current Korean damage, aspd etc. calculations, barring the very new changes that were released with episode 7 on the eleventh. There's ways in MH to enchant that buff attack speed that we don't have at the moment, either.
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Fathuran wrote on 2010-11-13 21:13
I'm not exactly knowledgeable of the stats and all the miniscule details and stuffs of each, but as someone who recently just started using hammers (just got my Bone Hammuh craftified) I think playing hammer whether solo or in group provides a nice challenge. Swords, as we all know, is faster and is easier to cancel out of, plus I dare say that more aggressive (yes I said aggressive) players would do well with swords due to being able to stick in there and stab stab like a heavily armored hornet and take advantage of the much easier ability to block attacks.
For hammers, due to the delayed ability to be able to raise our shields to block incoming attacks, we are forced to play a more passive, defensive game by taking full advantage of counterrattack. Due to this in my short time of playing hammers, I've actually been able to learn my bosses easier, because by playing a more passive game, I learn my enemies' moves. Sword can wail on an enemy and quickly raise shield to defend, while hammer must be extremely cautious when fighting the enemy, maybe only doing a very short combo if even that while anticipating the next move so as to counterrattack, once that is done, the pain can be laid on.
This is just my personal opinion, and as a Hammer Fiona, I've had a more interesting, and fun game since I've switched weapons due to the challenging playstyle. In groups, as pointed out, we lay on the pain when the enemy is distracted, however I'm not sure how this will play out later on when the next class, which is a big heavy hitter comes out, who is pretty much a male, much bigger hammer fiona (with a bigger hammer). How the two will perform side by side will be interesting to see.
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heretic304 wrote on 2010-11-14 08:45
Quote from Fathuran;214202:
I'm not exactly knowledgeable of the stats and all the miniscule details and stuffs of each, but as someone who recently just started using hammers (just got my Bone Hammuh craftified) I think playing hammer whether solo or in group provides a nice challenge. Swords, as we all know, is faster and is easier to cancel out of, plus I dare say that more aggressive (yes I said aggressive) players would do well with swords due to being able to stick in there and stab stab like a heavily armored hornet and take advantage of the much easier ability to block attacks.
For hammers, due to the delayed ability to be able to raise our shields to block incoming attacks, we are forced to play a more passive, defensive game by taking full advantage of counterrattack. Due to this in my short time of playing hammers, I've actually been able to learn my bosses easier, because by playing a more passive game, I learn my enemies' moves. Sword can wail on an enemy and quickly raise shield to defend, while hammer must be extremely cautious when fighting the enemy, maybe only doing a very short combo if even that while anticipating the next move so as to counterrattack, once that is done, the pain can be laid on.
This is just my personal opinion, and as a Hammer Fiona, I've had a more interesting, and fun game since I've switched weapons due to the challenging playstyle. In groups, as pointed out, we lay on the pain when the enemy is distracted, however I'm not sure how this will play out later on when the next class, which is a big heavy hitter comes out, who is pretty much a male, much bigger hammer fiona (with a bigger hammer). How the two will perform side by side will be interesting to see.
You make it sound as if Swordiona doesn't know what the bosses attacks are just because she can raise defense so quickly. I feel that because I can attack and guard so quickly, it's just as important for me to learn the boss's combos because then I'll know when it's safe to add in an extra hit or two before falling back to a defensive, or retaliatory, stance. I find Hammiona to play more like Lann and Scythe Evy. You wait for the opening and attack to hit where the boss will be, rather than tanking the boss like a Swordiona does. If you do wish to stay close to the boss, then yes you'd need to play a bit more passive so you have enough time to guard.
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Fathuran wrote on 2010-11-14 08:55
Quote from heretic304;214824:
You make it sound as if Swordiona doesn't know what the bosses attacks are just because she can raise defense so quickly. I feel that because I can attack and guard so quickly, it's just as important for me to learn the boss's combos because then I'll know when it's safe to add in an extra hit or two before falling back to a defensive, or retaliatory, stance. I find Hammiona to play more like Lann and Scythe Evy. You wait for the opening and attack to hit where the boss will be, rather than tanking the boss like a Swordiona does. If you do wish to stay close to the boss, then yes you'd need to play a bit more passive so you have enough time to guard.
I thought about editing my post several times because I thought people would think what you voiced, which is take my post in a way that I implied Sword Fionas don't know a boss' combos. I think everyone should learn the boss' combo to the letter. I just think that Sword Fionas just have a slightly easier time, not in any way say that they are stupid or are any less skilled than their hammer using companions.
When it comes down to it, Hammer and Sword is completely opinion. Each has their strengths and weaknesses, but they both can do the same job just the same, it just may take an extra step on certain jobs depending on the weapon you use.
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Bink wrote on 2010-11-14 11:40
I'm not very savvy on concrete numbers and timing/frames, but in my opinion I'm still able to bring up my defense nearly as quickly with my Hammer as I can my sword. When it comes down to clutch moments (erm, Red Tyrant and the possibility of some pokey boat 3 bosses are the only examples that come into my mind atm) I'm still able to defend in time, just with hammer I barely see myself raising my shield before I get that Heavy Stander block animation.
The only difference I've seen is that Hammer combos have a longer wind up time. So if you're trying a boss with the same timing as a sword fiona... well of course it's going to hit you in the face. I've found that if I start a little earlier that won't really happen. This usually ends up to me using Butterfly when I would have Amaranth'd or Hammer #1 when I could have blossomed, but I feel that hammer's massive damage and crit bonuses to the normal attacks I'm landing anyways make up for that (apologies if I'm wrong, this is from personal experience only).
That being said, whenever I walked into a boss I didn't know how to do, I've always had my Sword Equipped. Sword is much more forgiving when you overextend on something you shouldn't have done (especially when your solo-ing), which is priceless when you don't know what the heck the boss is gonna do anyways. Amaranth also seems to have a bigger radial range in comparison to stigma (I think... it seems that way at least. Kinda iffy on if it's actually true or not).
In my opinion, a Hammer Fiona can be just as much defensive as a Sword Fiona. The only problem is you're going to have to precisely figure out where you and the boss is going to be right when he telegraphs his attack.
Again, this is sole based on my personal experience. A number cruncher max dps min/maxer will probably prove me wrong in terms of raw data.
and +1 for turning Hammer 1 into a skill <3.
edit: For just about any boss that I can reliably counter, I bring my hammer :3.
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risend wrote on 2010-11-14 12:00
I made a sword to get the blossom title, after that I haven't looked back at swords.
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Miyumi wrote on 2010-11-14 14:29
It's all personal preference!! :]