synthesis

• krpr wrote on 2011-01-03 10:20
  1st of all, i don't really like to spend money on skill ranking, so wanted to ask
  what are my chances of getting this capped while spending the minimum gold on it and not going insane by the middle?
  
  aka, how hard is this thing to rank? i've heard ppl say they spent a lot on it. Kinda afraid to start :I
• Xemnas wrote on 2011-01-03 10:53
  You probably will take way longer to train it if you spend barely anything on it.
  
  It's definitely one of the gold draining skills.
• Ailyene wrote on 2011-01-03 11:14
  You will have to spend a couple mil on it just in NPC items alone when doing the gathering knives/clothing part of the training requirements. Unless you really plan on fishing and hunting all the weapons/clothes. Then you will never ever finish it.
  
  Honestly, most of the expensive parts of synthesis for me were the NPC items since for the herb requirements, I bought all my herbs but synthed them into mana herbs and made them into pots, then resold the pots to make back a lot of money. It would certainly lessen the amount of money you'd need to spend if you have a very high-ranked alchemy mastery (higher synthesis success rate and therefore less fails).
  
  If you plan on not buying any of your non-NPC materials...yeah, that's going to take you a long, long time. Synthesis is not anywhere near as money-draining as blacksmithing or tailoring, but still costs a couple mil to get done, depending on your synthesis success rate.
  
  I think the main thing that drove me crazy when ranking this skill was when the screen told me I had a 60% chance of synthing something, yet I'd fail 25/30 times. T__T
• Cryosite wrote on 2011-01-03 15:14
  You're going to have to throw some money away to rank this skill; impossible to avoid. Once you have it ranked up, you're still going to sink a fair amount of money into it before getting anything of value (war swords, wing bows, executioner swords, composite shields) and likely not as much as you put into it. Synthesis is a skill for gamblers who dream of getting that multi-million gold value item on their first few tries.
  
  There are some other things the skill is good for, but that seems to be the popular once. But you've already missed the gravy train; almost everything that can be acquired from synthesis only has gone down in price.
  
  Also: making mp pots via synthesis? I dunno about your sever, but white herbs alone cost 20-25k/stack. Bloody herbs often 5-8k/stack, while sunlights are generally too cheap that most don't bother selling them. Assuming 100% success rate on synthesis, you're still spending 26-34k/stack just to make the mana herbs (which sell for 10-15k/stack here) losing yourself 16k-24k/stack right there. MP100's only sell for 20k-30k here, so even with a barely minimal cost on herbs being 27k, you're only making money if the potions sell for their max price.
  
  At best you could say that method helps you cut your losses some, but it certainly is not lucrative in Ruairi.
• EndlessDreams wrote on 2011-01-03 17:22
  If you have tons of blood herbs around, you can save yourself tons of money. You can do the herb/pot requirements by doing shear about amount cheap NPC stuff, and a lot of time. You will have to buy the gathering knives and popo dresses for r9+ though. Those aren't exactly expensive, but they do add up.
  
  I spent way less than 1m capping this skill.
  
  Is it useful to me? Nope. None of the stuff are easy to make, and sell for a lot nowadays.
• Sunureu13 wrote on 2011-01-03 19:02
  Get r2+ Alchemy Mastery before you start this. It helps a whole lot.
  
  Yes, you WILL have to spend money on herbs, unless you raft for 200+ stacks, and 200+ stacks of hp50s. Yes, you will be making Mandrakes.
  
  The NPC items (gathering knives and popo skirts) are ridiculously cheap compared to the herbs. I spent about 500k on them from r9 to r6.
  
  It's not hard to rank perse, it's just expensive and time-consuming.
  
  I spent probably 4-5 million ranking it. I also threw about 10 million into those ovens. But it's been good to me, 4 War Swords, a Dragon Shield, a bunch of 4/2 Vales and 3/0 Heteros, a Pirate Captain Suit, and some now worthless Fitted Cords Suit .-. But I've made my money back and then-some.
• Dusk wrote on 2011-01-03 19:49

  Quote from Sunureu13;274644:

  Get r2+ Alchemy Mastery before you start this. It helps a whole lot.
  
  Yes, you WILL have to spend money on herbs, unless you raft for 200+ stacks, and 200+ stacks of hp50s. Yes, you will be making Mandrakes.
  
  The NPC items (gathering knives and popo skirts) are ridiculously cheap compared to the herbs. I spent about 500k on them from r9 to r6.
  
  It's not hard to rank perse, it's just expensive and time-consuming.
  
  I spent probably 4-5 million ranking it. I also threw about 10 million into those ovens. But it's been good to me, 4 War Swords, a Dragon Shield, a bunch of 4/2 Vales and 3/0 Heteros, a Pirate Captain Suit, and some now worthless Fitted Cords Suit .-. But I've made my money back and then-some.

  
  hnnnnnnngggggggg I really want to dual wield War Swords. Probably going to have to start Synthesis soon.
• Ailyene wrote on 2011-01-03 21:04

  Quote from Cryosite;274469:

  Also: making mp pots via synthesis? I dunno about your sever, but white herbs alone cost 20-25k/stack. Bloody herbs often 5-8k/stack, while sunlights are generally too cheap that most don't bother selling them. Assuming 100% success rate on synthesis, you're still spending 26-34k/stack just to make the mana herbs (which sell for 10-15k/stack here) losing yourself 16k-24k/stack right there. MP100's only sell for 20k-30k here, so even with a barely minimal cost on herbs being 27k, you're only making money if the potions sell for their max price.

  
  
  I suggested making mana herbs instead of mandrakes so you can make the mana herbs into MP pots to resell so you can gain some money back, for training. Not to actually make money with it. There isn't much use for mandrakes except to train potion making and they aren't exactly that easy to make either, so mana herbs are better in my opinion.
• krpr wrote on 2011-01-03 21:30

  Quote from EndlessDreams;274576:

  Is it useful to me? Nope. None of the stuff are easy to make, and sell for a lot nowadays.

  
  
  dorren spam, makes lving up easier since with a relatively decent party it's possible to get the same xp as one golden apple adv in 10~20 mins :D
  main motive i want it since it's easier to get 2 1k+ friends than a high ranked synth
  
  @costs. I think you guys misunderstood me. I mentioned i would try to spend the minimum possible, after all already heard of people spending stuff like 10~15mil to rank this. If i wanted to spend that much money i would rank tailoring instead, even if i would spend more at least id gain dex instead .... 4 MP lol
• Xemnas wrote on 2011-01-03 21:50

  Quote from krpr;274752:

  
  @costs. I think you guys misunderstood me. I mentioned i would try to spend the minimum possible, after all already heard of people spending stuff like 10~15mil to rank this. If i wanted to spend that much money i would rank tailoring instead, even if i would spend more at least id gain dex instead .... 4 MP lol

  
  They did tell you the minimum. It's a money drain skill, and there's no way around it.
• Bankai231 wrote on 2011-01-03 21:59

  Quote from Sunureu13;274644:

  Get r2+ Alchemy Mastery before you start this. It helps a whole lot.
  
  Yes, you WILL have to spend money on herbs, unless you raft for 200+ stacks, and 200+ stacks of hp50s. Yes, you will be making Mandrakes.
  
  The NPC items (gathering knives and popo skirts) are ridiculously cheap compared to the herbs. I spent about 500k on them from r9 to r6.
  
  It's not hard to rank perse, it's just expensive and time-consuming.
  
  I spent probably 4-5 million ranking it. I also threw about 10 million into those ovens. But it's been good to me, 4 War Swords, a Dragon Shield, a bunch of 4/2 Vales and 3/0 Heteros, a Pirate Captain Suit, and some now worthless Fitted Cords Suit .-. But I've made my money back and then-some.

  
  
  Anything Sunu says about alchemy I would back up 110%. He knows what hes talking about when it comes to alchemy.
  But yeah Good amount of gold going into the skill.
• Zeo wrote on 2011-01-03 22:00
  I find synthesis to be useful in one or other way. Like.. if I get random expensive items from field boss drop, I would use those to synthesis, of course.
  
  (got a Pirate Captian suit recently from synthesis)
  
  But yeah.. I would say rank B or A.. I think is hardest because you have to collect ton of holy waters to rank it up faster way.. unless you want to do it other way (can train but take like 10x more slower) by random synthesisizing the pots.
• Cookies wrote on 2011-01-03 22:28
  I spent around 2million in gold buying tork's hunter suits and gathering knives from rank 9-6, and probably 300k from novice to A with bloody herbs.
  
  Hp50s and bloody herbs can easily be farmed with rafting, and the braids used for clovers can be made with just half an hour of thread farming.
  Potion synthesis is nowhere as annoying as running around for weapon/clothing synthesis, you can get it done pretty easily with just hp/sp10s and base potions.
  
  High ranked alchemy mastery is only good for the ranks past A, when you won't be relying on the points from failing.
  The only annoying thing about synthesis is the trips between ovens and npcs.
• Sunureu13 wrote on 2011-01-03 22:55

  Quote from krpr;274752:

  dorren spam, makes lving up easier since with a relatively decent party it's possible to get the same xp as one golden apple adv in 10~20 mins :D
  main motive i want it since it's easier to get 2 1k+ friends than a high ranked synth

  
  
  yes yes yes. Dorren's Request can be done in 10 minutes with a good party. That's over 1m xp/hour. And yes, high rank synthers are hard to come by, and are in high demand for this reason.
  
  

  Quote from krpr;274752:

  @costs. I think you guys misunderstood me. I mentioned i would try to spend the minimum possible, after all already heard of people spending stuff like 10~15mil to rank this. If i wanted to spend that much money i would rank tailoring instead, even if i would spend more at least id gain dex instead .... 4 MP lol

  
  
  No way would this cost 10m+ to rank, unless you have rN mastery or something. With a decent ranked mastery (r5+, or r2 since it's mainly kills from r8 -> r2) can get a pretty decent success rate with most fixed recipes. It also helps to spam for Melting equipment. 3% my not seem like a lot, but it makes a huge difference when you're doing 500+ synths for a rank. It especially helps with making Clovers. That's 50% of your training for just succeeding, not counting the recipe fails and and synth success/recipe success. You may need 50 stacks of braids, but that's maybe a day's worth of thread farming.
  
  Synthesis, or Alchemy in general, is not about stat gain (except for the 132 MP and 45 HP). It's about damage and production. If you want a guaranteed profit and stat gain, by all means go for tailoring, weaving, smithing (lol) or potion making (lol).
• krpr wrote on 2011-01-03 23:11

  Quote from Sunureu13;274838:

  Synthesis, or Alchemy in general, is not about stat gain (except for the 132 MP and 45 HP). It's about damage and production. If you want a guaranteed profit and stat gain, by all means go for tailoring, weaving, smithing (lol) or potion making (lol).

  
  
  getting to r9 later, r1 done :D, same as tailoring and just no
  And my alch mastery is B atm. Though if this go well, i might as well rush it to 5 then rank the rest later