Windmill or Refine?

• Sunureu13 wrote on 2011-02-09 21:38
  First off, it's my Giant alt. 150ish total. 650-750 CP, 60 Dex at 50/15.
  
  Background: Currently r3 Windmill, rN Refine. I have the -CP to get every interval of 50 between 1 and 750. I have a -70 Dex set. I have the money to buy all my ores from rN to r1.
  
  Dilemma: I have end-game weapons with mid-game enchants;
  
  195 high grade Topaz Bold Iron Maces
  221 mid grade Crocodile Broad Axe S3
  216 r1 sigged Untamed Destruction DSK
  
  But I do not have the dex to wield them properly. 51, 25, 40 % respectively. I do not want to buy/make regular maces, a battle hammer, or dragon blade.
  
  This is why I want to get r1 Refine so I can work on other +dex skills, after WM. But I want to get r1 WM for the extra radius. But what's the point of it if I can't hit high damage with it? Both of these can be in my next RB. 53 AP for refine + r2 WM, or 54 AP for r1 WM + a few ranks of refine.
  
  I don't really plan on weekly RBing, as this is just an alt. So I don't want to go another 3 weeks (on top of this next week) of low damage or smaller wm radius.
• Wing wrote on 2011-02-09 21:47
  Wm.
• Shizukani wrote on 2011-02-09 22:05
  Do Refining first. Since you already have all the money for it, ranking it should be a breeze. And it doesn't add that much CP either, around 4 CP. Which is basically negligible.
  
  You can rank Windmill afterwards. Having more Dex and hitting higher with it will make your life a bit easier. And it's a Giant, so Windmill shouldn't be too hard either.
• Zid wrote on 2011-02-09 23:21
  Assuming your base Melee damage is 0, an extra 9% Balance will do produce a higher average damage output than an extra 20% damage in Windmill.
  
  For example, let's take your Iron Maces (19~90 at least, since I don't know how much +stats high grade gives).
  
  At 51% Balance (since you're not clear on "a few ranks of Refine", so I'll say +0 Dex from Refine) and r1 Windmill...
  
  90(.51) + 19(.49) = 55.21 average damage
  
  55.21 * 2.5 = 138.025 average Windmill damage
  
  __________
  
  r1 Refine gives +36 Dex, or 9% Balance. That boosts your Iron Mace's Balance to 60%, but leaves Windmill to r2 (230% damage).
  
  90(.6) + 19(.4) = 61.6 average damage
  
  61.6 * 2.3 = 141.68 average Windmill damage
  
  Keep in mind, this is if your Giant has 0~0 Melee damage without weapons. It could change into a different result by with different min and max dmg, but by the time you worry about that, you usually should have r1 of both skills by now.
• truefire wrote on 2011-02-09 23:47
  Windmill first, with occasional ranks of Refine as a side project when you have spare AP. Ranking Refine will have little to no impact on your CP-based ability to train Windmill, and Windmill will have absolutely no impact on your ability to rank Refine. Until you are ready to rank Refine, there are many ways to keep your balance around 80%, one of them being dual-wielding high-balance weapons. And let's not forget, Windmill becoming powerful increases your AP accrual for both Windmill and Refine.
  
  Edited out gladius dual-wielding because the OP is talking about giants, not humans
• Ryoko wrote on 2011-02-10 00:07
  WM first..Besides, giants have WM so much easier.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2011-02-10 00:10
  You're almost done with WM.
  Just go get it over with first and then focus on refining.
• Taycat wrote on 2011-02-10 00:26
  WM.
• Justified wrote on 2011-02-10 00:57
  Windmill
  
  Because when you do need refine, -70 Dex equips, -20 Dex title, -30 Dex persona, and -15 (-30) Dex Vales Fire makes it a cakewalk [total -135/-150].
• Wing wrote on 2011-02-10 01:00
  Personas makes it so easy.
• TropicalCat wrote on 2011-02-10 01:18

  Quote from Sunureu13;327817:

  First off, it's my Giant alt. 150ish total. 650-750 CP, 60 Dex at 50/15.
  
  Background: Currently r3 Windmill, rN Refine. I have the -CP to get every interval of 50 between 1 and 750. I have a -70 Dex set. I have the money to buy all my ores from rN to r1.
  
  Dilemma: I have end-game weapons with mid-game enchants;
  
  195 high grade Topaz Bold Iron Maces
  221 mid grade Crocodile Broad Axe S3
  216 r1 sigged Untamed Destruction DSK
  
  But I do not have the dex to wield them properly. 51, 25, 40 % respectively. I do not want to buy/make regular maces, a battle hammer, or dragon blade.
  
  This is why I want to get r1 Refine so I can work on other +dex skills, after WM. But I want to get r1 WM for the extra radius. But what's the point of it if I can't hit high damage with it? Both of these can be in my next RB. 53 AP for refine + r2 WM, or 54 AP for r1 WM + a few ranks of refine.
  
  I don't really plan on weekly RBing, as this is just an alt. So I don't want to go another 3 weeks (on top of this next week) of low damage or smaller wm radius.

  
  
  Golemgolemgolem
• Sunureu13 wrote on 2011-02-10 01:43
  Main reason I made my giant is to get away from alchemy and use melee.
• Cuculain wrote on 2011-02-10 01:56
  How much money is needed to get refine to r1? e-o
• Sunureu13 wrote on 2011-02-10 02:10
  Not much. Since Iron is 800, and everything else is <4k. Plus I have a 6/1/1 fragger, so I need to buy even less.
• kevinXIV wrote on 2011-02-10 02:15

  Quote from Cuculain;328414:

  How much money is needed to get refine to r1? e-o

  
  
  lol it cost me ~800k just for all mythril fails.. with Production Failure pots + Double Life Skill Pots.. thats how refining hated me.. FFFFFFFFUUUUU that 50% Success rate.. LIES!! D: