The Special Equipment Box is kind of messed up.

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Rydian wrote on 2016-08-28 05:53

So a lot of people complain that gachas devalue crafting by generating high-quality items with no in-game effort. Normally the counter-argument is "players can craft these weapons if they want, gachas are just a fast way to them".

Then we started getting X-grade items, and it's like, we can't craft those that high... in NA, right? With the general counter being "there's no damage bonus past S so it doesn't matter".

Well, now in this box we have Golden Guns being generated with crafting rolls. This means they have much higher stats than previously-generated ones, by far. Normal/old ones are 33-88 damage with 25 dura, whereas I saw multiple stat variations up to 43-108 damage with 46 dura. Meaning we get items with stats that we couldn't get before.

Now, many of the discrepancies seen in this gacha's items can be explained by the items being set to generate without any additional arguments in the scripts (the telltale sign being the new Golden Guns having palette colors instead of flashies).

"But we can't craft those types of weapons anyways", blah blah blah.

Well, I saw something in a shop today for 25K.

[Image: http://i.imgur.com/sZgPlQa.png]

That's higher stats than the crafting rolls, and all stats are buffed, not just one or two.
Attack: 6-60 -> 8-62
Critical: 12% -> 17%
Balance: 13% -> 23%
Durability: 32 -> 37

So that's 2 min, 2 max, 5 crit, 10 balance, and 5 dura higher than the max crafting roll.

Hm, those numbers seem familiar, right?

... that's the X-grade BLACKSMITHING BONUSES.

ghfjksdhlsfjkhs

[SIZE="1"](Also turns out the Golden Guns with the really high stats have the X-grade bonuses too.)[/SIZE]

Clarification: So yeah, somebody dun' goofed and the gacha's putting out stuff higher than we could get in pretty much any cases, so hunt these while you can. I haven't seen any Dowra versions likes the Taunes screenshotted, people might be hoarding them, but theoretically they can get popped out too.
thunderbro wrote on 2016-08-28 08:20

I've noticed that this gacha has had weapons in with the same color palette as the one in the screenshot, every single weapon with that palette has the higher x-grade stats, even compared to the same types of weapons in the gacha with regular randomized palettes.

Of course the black stars and Golden Guns don't seem to have that palette, but all of those seem to have x-grade stats like you said.
Konrad wrote on 2016-08-28 09:17

Typical DevCat.
"Hey, this one feature is a bit outdated and impractical. How do we fix it?"
"Let's forget about it and make something new, preferably in a gachapon."
ironwoman wrote on 2016-08-28 09:25

Yeah, generally speaking, I was fine with most of the gachas anyway, because more often than not, players could create weapons that are superior to gacha weapons.

This gacha though, definitely crossed the line (not to mention the Fierce accs). I honestly don't get what NA team was thinking, especially considering that now there's literally 0 reason to get the Celtic Dowras (except for bragging rights, but you're probably gonna be marked off as a dumbass who's using a gun that's worse than gacha Dowras for lot of effort). Seems counter intuitive to the new dungeon patch to say the least. At least the Celtic weapons still weren't the highest grade.
Infighter wrote on 2016-08-28 12:37

Quote from ironwoman;1297930:
Yeah, generally speaking, I was fine with most of the gachas anyway, because more often than not, players could create weapons that are superior to gacha weapons.

This gacha though, definitely crossed the line (not to mention the Fierce accs). I honestly don't get what NA team was thinking, especially considering that now there's literally 0 reason to get the Celtic Dowras (except for bragging rights, but you're probably gonna be marked off as a dumbass who's using a gun that's worse than gacha Dowras for lot of effort). Seems counter intuitive to the new dungeon patch to say the least. At least the Celtic weapons still weren't the highest grade.

Its funny how they released weapons like Dowra SE and Taunes MK to gachas with the highest grade possible at the same time as Celtic Dowra Ace which are 10x harder to get not to mention the higher chances to get the worst (t)roll stats thanks to RNGsus. So I wasn't even interested about this gachapon since I do not have NX to make it rain. But then a guildie showed me these 12min-24max Dowra SE...

I obviously took the Dowras SE, since Celtic is 12min and 28+ max attack perfect base rolls vs. 12min - 24 max att Dowra SE? Its a joke honestly. Now I rather wait for a Celtic Dowra Ace to come freshly baked from a gachapon with a 18min~30max X-roll since we know this gach pattern will continue.

inb4 64th floor accs, soluna sword, destruction robe from gach
Rydian wrote on 2016-08-28 18:39

SE's too, and yup, seems like the palette matches.

[Image: http://i.imgur.com/mdahL2O.png]

(Somebody else's shot.)
Konrad wrote on 2016-08-28 19:07

I'm conflicted. I could take part in this transgression and feel bad for doing so, or keep painstakingly ranking my Engineering and fight a greatly uneven battle against RNG to get a gun with best rolls.
Tropa wrote on 2016-08-29 12:42

Why put effort into anything when I can just buy what you want?

That's really been the "thing" for a long time with this game.

Just waiting for the new weapons come out in some special gachapon, gonna give it a few motnhs.
Xeno wrote on 2016-08-29 21:14

Quote from Tropa;1297956:
Why put effort into anything when I can just buy what you want?

That's really been the "thing" for a long time with this game.

Just waiting for the new weapons come out in some special gachapon, gonna give it a few motnhs.

The amount of salt is real. Mabinogi has been p2w since it came out and you had to pay money to buy rebirths. It literally launched as a p2w game straight up if you couldn't afford those. If you hate the game so much, honestly why even bother being a part of the community any longer, just to shit on every post/thread calling it p2w when it has always been this way? Has it gotten worse? Yes. Is this a shocking or unexpected thing? No, not at all. Mabinogi is pay 2 win. The best items often come out in Gachapon. This is not news, this has been the case since the game came out.

I don't even know how we are having this discussion after fierce ribbons came out in gachapon years back, an item that is far better than any obtainable in-game and not even craftable at all, and now we're QQing about like 4 extra damage on some guns when people have capped stats an 1300+ max damage. And reforges, another item you CAN ONLY buy that is REQUIRED to have even close to relevant gear.

This community, lol. You either enjoy the game and have fun playing it, or you are miserable and shit on the community and every post for everyone else who still enjoys it because it is p2w, when it always has been that way. I don't understand it personally. This game isn't a competition. No one is competing for world first kills or taking part in tournaments. There isn't even GvG anymore. You play because you enjoy it. That's it. No reason to shit on everyone else's parade because it doesn't meet your p2w standard.
Konrad wrote on 2016-08-29 22:52

It's not even about pay to win. Most of cash shop items can be bought with in-game gold, including both reforges and these new gacha weapons (and both have pretty reasonable prices no less), so some would argue if it's p2w at all.

It's about the developers/publisher not knowing what in the world are they doing - almost never fixing or balancing out what needs their attention, only spitting out new content that keeps invalidating old one, not even bothering to write story which doesn't contradict itself as of lately. There are strong points though. Dungeon revamp is really nice and actual auction house will be a much needed addition.

What I really hate about mabi - it takes a step forward only to follow up with another one back. There is so much potential, so much to polish up, and when you think the game is finally on its way to permanent improvement they do something stupid again.
ironwoman wrote on 2016-08-29 23:44

Quote from Xeno;1297960:
The amount of salt is real. Mabinogi has been p2w since it came out and you had to pay money to buy rebirths. It literally launched as a p2w game straight up if you couldn't afford those. If you hate the game so much, honestly why even bother being a part of the community any longer, just to shit on every post/thread calling it p2w when it has always been this way? Has it gotten worse? Yes. Is this a shocking or unexpected thing? No, not at all. Mabinogi is pay 2 win. The best items often come out in Gachapon. This is not news, this has been the case since the game came out.

I don't even know how we are having this discussion after fierce ribbons came out in gachapon years back, an item that is far better than any obtainable in-game and not even craftable at all, and now we're QQing about like 4 extra damage on some guns when people have capped stats an 1300+ max damage. And reforges, another item you CAN ONLY buy that is REQUIRED to have even close to relevant gear.

This community, lol. You either enjoy the game and have fun playing it, or you are miserable and shit on the community and every post for everyone else who still enjoys it because it is p2w, when it always has been that way. I don't understand it personally. This game isn't a competition. No one is competing for world first kills or taking part in tournaments. There isn't even GvG anymore. You play because you enjoy it. That's it. No reason to shit on everyone else's parade because it doesn't meet your p2w standard.

Going off with this, what are you exactly bringing by hopping on this "I HATE MABI AND ITS P2W SHIT" train? To me, it seems more like a mob mentality thing, no offense.

Am I disappointed with this gacha? Yes. Do I think this was the worst thing to happen in P2W standards? It could be worse. Do I think NA will release Destruction Robe and Soluna Sword? Definitely not, mats maybe. I'm sorry if I sound rude, but to me all the people saying "oh, Soluna Sword and '64th floor accs' will be in the gacha" sound dumb, and honestly seems like a result of "UGH I HATE NEXON AND THEIR DUMBASS P2W GACHAS" train. Just think a little more please instead of rabbling. All the newly released weapons are designed to take longer to create (probably even harder than Dragon weapons atm), and dragon weapons haven't been introduced in the gacha yet. You guys are so quick to jump to silly conclusions, maybe you can tone down a little and think from a more logical perspective.

As for "Why put effort into anything when I can just buy what you want?", I don't know man, have you seen Nexon release Bhafel Hunters before? What if I really wanted one? Pretty sure I can't just gacha that one through (and not anytime soon).

I honestly have to echo Xeno. Whenever gachas are released, why are you posting complaints, especially for those of you that don't even play anymore?

I'm not gonna say I like the idea of this gachapon, but for now I'm dealing with it. And y'all should learn to deal with it as well.
Rydian wrote on 2016-08-30 22:22

Quote from Xeno;1297960:
I don't even know how we are having this discussion after fierce ribbons came out in gachapon years back
Hey yo, if I went and took a crap on your porch one day, and then a week later did it again... you wouldn't complain the second time? I mean I've already done it so why even bother to bring it up?

But seriously, I'm more annoyed at how messed up this is in a technical sense. This is actually new as far as I know, giving items blacksmithing bonuses that aren't eligible for them.
Infighter wrote on 2016-08-31 21:50

Quote from Xeno;1297960:
The amount of salt is real. Mabinogi has been p2w since it came out and you had to pay money to buy rebirths. It literally launched as a p2w game straight up if you couldn't afford those. If you hate the game so much, honestly why even bother being a part of the community any longer, just to shit on every post/thread calling it p2w when it has always been this way? Has it gotten worse? Yes. Is this a shocking or unexpected thing? No, not at all. Mabinogi is pay 2 win. The best items often come out in Gachapon. This is not news, this has been the case since the game came out.

I don't even know how we are having this discussion after fierce ribbons came out in gachapon years back, an item that is far better than any obtainable in-game and not even craftable at all, and now we're QQing about like 4 extra damage on some guns when people have capped stats an 1300+ max damage. And reforges, another item you CAN ONLY buy that is REQUIRED to have even close to relevant gear.

This community, lol. You either enjoy the game and have fun playing it, or you are miserable and shit on the community and every post for everyone else who still enjoys it because it is p2w, when it always has been that way. I don't understand it personally. This game isn't a competition. No one is competing for world first kills or taking part in tournaments. There isn't even GvG anymore. You play because you enjoy it. That's it. No reason to shit on everyone else's parade because it doesn't meet your p2w standard.

To he honest, I think Mabinogi is way less pay2win than MapleStory, just to have a comparison to Nexon games.

At least Mabinogi have done positive steps during the years by making their game less p2w. By having rebirths free and then making it weekly, free personal shops, Baltane Adv shop like features, Phantasm and Dungeon revamps giving fair amount of goodies and rares non-obtainable in a gachapon not to mention fair amounts of items can be bought with gold. The game is fair with or without p2w.

Quote from ironwoman;1297965:
...oh, Soluna Sword and '64th floor accs' will be in the gacha" sound dumb, and honestly seems like a result of "UGH I HATE NEXON AND THEIR DUMBASS P2W GACHAS" train. Just think a little more please instead of rabbling. All the newly released weapons are designed to take longer to create (probably even harder than Dragon weapons atm), and dragon weapons haven't been introduced in the gacha yet. You guys are so quick to jump to silly conclusions, maybe you can tone down a little and think from a more logical perspective.

As for "Why put effort into anything when I can just buy what you want?", I don't know man, have you seen Nexon release Bhafel Hunters before? What if I really wanted one? Pretty sure I can't just gacha that one through (and not anytime soon).

I honestly have to echo Xeno. Whenever gachas are released, why are you posting complaints, especially for those of you that don't even play anymore?

I'm not gonna say I like the idea of this gachapon, but for now I'm dealing with it. And y'all should learn to deal with it as well.

Those people who were talking about "...Soluna Sword and 64th floor accs..." and "Why put effort into anything when I can just buy what you want?" seems to be making fun and sarcastic means of Nexon's cheap ways of craving for more money, not to mention there is an updated time extension for that gachapon which proves that perspective.

The point on this thread though is that this gachapon doesn't even fit in for the game life skill goals due to those unrealistically high rolls in comparison to the ones produced by a player. I rather see some patterns/manuals or even materials thrown in there instead of freshly gacha'ed equipment.

Why craftables instead of ready to sell equipments?
Because it would make it up for the game so people can actually use Tailoring, Blacksmithing and such other production skills to craft items. Also, I wouldn't mind if they release some weapons once in awhile with r1 pre-reforge. I bought a Gloomy Sunday 1 week ago and I'm happy with them. But the main concern about this gachapon (and future ones) is that it exceed the possible rolls that even a player can craft is just rude for the dedicated crafting player base in the game instead of actually stimulating the use of production life skills as a source or high-end equipment supply, fashionogi goodies, etc.

Even their Phantasm/Dungeon revamp content follows the example of the ideas I'm trying to state here by making some of the Succubus clothing being crafted by a player, more smithing items being craftable, and many more. This is not about pay2win train, its about making proper decisions to make the game content interesting.

Quote from Rydian;1297989:
"...This is actually new as far as I know, giving items blacksmithing bonuses that aren't eligible for them."

Indeed
Rydian wrote on 2016-09-22 05:30

Okay I'm popping in real quick (will catch up on other stuff later) because I just found out something else. I heard that the gacha was also giving out a Black Dragon Knight's Giant Sword...

... that is also a staff. And it doesn't mention this, the only way people found out was when they could suddenly use Lightning Rod with it.

I found somebody selling two (alongside other weapon gacha weapons) in housing on Ruairi, the visible difference being that this variety has 222 max instead of 220 (checked stats, A+ grade). Logged it to confirm it's the item ID of the for-some-reason-a-staff variety.

[code]<Mabi_Item ID="40804" DB_StoreType="1" Category="/equip/twohand/weapon/edged/steel/blade/smith_repairable/not_enchantable/piercing/human_giant_only/staff/weapontype_combat/twohand_weapon_skin/"[/code]
http://mabinogi.x10.mx/itemdb/?action=view&item=40804

[code]042 [........004C4B40] Int : 5000000
043 [005000CC81AD0C97] Long : 22518876485782679
044 [..............02] Byte : 2
045 [................] Bin : 00 00 00 00 64 9F 00 00 7C 7B 9A 00 91 8E A1 00
56 53 6A 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
046 [................] Bin : 01 27 DD 49 60 EA 00 00 70 17 00 00 00 00 00 00
78 69 00 00 78 69 00 00 F0 55 00 00 8E 00 DE 00
00 00 00 00 2F 36 50 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
03 F6 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 FF FF FF FF 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 50 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
17 4F 01 00
047 [................] String : LP:1:1;QUAL:4:90;
048 [................] String :
049 [..............00] Byte : 0
050 [0000000000000000] Long : 0
051 [..............00] Byte : 0
052 [..............00] Byte : 0
053 [..............01] Byte : 1
054 [........004C4B40] Int : 5000000
055 [005000CC81FDD94C] Long : 22518876491077964
056 [..............02] Byte : 2
057 [................] Bin : 00 00 00 00 64 9F 00 00 A5 A3 B7 00 B6 B6 B6 00
7E 7E 7E 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
058 [................] Bin : 01 00 00 00 60 EA 00 00 70 17 00 00 00 00 00 00
78 69 00 00 78 69 00 00 F0 55 00 00 8E 00 DE 00
00 00 00 00 2F 36 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
03 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 FF FF FF FF 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
17 4F 01 00
059 [................] String : LP:1:1;QUAL:4:90;
060 [................] String :
061 [..............00] Byte : 0
062 [0000000000000000] Long : 0
063 [..............00] Byte : 0
064 [..............00] Byte : 0
065 [..............01] Byte : 1[/code]

64 9F = 40804.
koishi-sempai wrote on 2016-09-23 02:31

Quote from Rydian;1298289:
Okay I'm popping in real quick (will catch up on other stuff later) because I just found out something else. I heard that the gacha was also giving out a Black Dragon Knight's Giant Sword...

... that is also a staff. And it doesn't mention this, the only way people found out was when they could suddenly use Lightning Rod with it.

Wow they actually implemented it, cool.

This is the actual sword that Ruairi uses in Saga i'm pretty sure, someone should run Saga 6 and compare. But he is able to use Shockwave in one of his RPs in Saga 1 Ep 6.