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Odinwolfe wrote on 2010-06-29 09:48
Been juggling which Advanced magic to rank to 1 first.
I have all three and I find them all useful.
Before I finally got fireball (which took a friggin' year to get) I was ranking Thunder to 1.
I stopped at 6 and then deranked because I knew I should have finished AR.
I don't have any MAJOR difficulties in any dungeon/ shadow mission I do. but I think having a good Adv magic available, it being a high rank (Or rank 1) would make things much easier.
Fireball - R9 highest damage done 5,500 crit:awesome:
Ice spear -R9 highest damage done 2700 crit
Thunder- RC (lol) don't know, but at rank 6 I pulled in at least 3000 total damage with crits
My CP is already high as it is, so I don't think making it higher would affect me that much and I do have WM rank 1.
right now at level 48 I have about 1340 or so CP.
Note: I don't rebirth weekly, but I wish I could. College costs and such screws me.:T_T:
I usually free RB, but get a card here and there when I can.
I train to at least level 40, but getting to 60 has been getting easier and easier for me.:thumb:
I pull in average 70 AP per rebirth now.
TL;DR
My CP is high, I want a practical ADV magic that is rank 1. Which should I go with?:what:
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Liraiyu wrote on 2010-06-29 10:07
Thunder and Ice Spear are the most practical. Fireball is nice, but it costs so much mana and takes a long time to get all 5 charges up.
I'm not a mage though, so I don't know much about thunder and ice spear.
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Yogurticecream wrote on 2010-06-29 10:37
Whatever advance magic you choose, you should always consider to have a good supply of mana pots.
All three are practical and not practical in their own ways.
Ice Spear is good for mob control, and if you ever decide to rank up alchemy mastery R2-1, this is the skill you must have, preferably at R1, mainly due to the advantage of having the least mana usage (otherwise you need to bother your Ice Spear R1 friends - which not everyone will have). However, in certain party situations, it lacks speed and your team mates cannot attack frozen monsters, therefore this is a terrible attack to use at statue rooms (introduced in G11S2, tara castle missions).
Thunder is good if you like rafting. Very nice for exploration. It helps to clear out rooms too, however it's not as effective as Fireball when it comes to Hard Mode.
Fireball isn't as bad as what people make it out to be. It boasts the highest attacking figures out of the three advanced magic. The only thing is that Fireball is sometimes underrated because of it being slow. Definitely going to be the main opening and continuous attack on rooms where the multi-aggro and high-hp monsters are. Fastest clearing parties use it in Sulphur spiders mission. This is a very useful attack if you tend to party a lot. So it will depend on where you are fighting and your gameplay style to see if Fireball gives you the best usage it has to offer.
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Odinwolfe wrote on 2010-06-29 10:41
Quote from Yogurticecream;79020:
Whatever advance magic you choose, you should always consider to have a good supply of mana pots.
All three are practical and not practical in their own ways.
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Thanks for that, all of it was well said and has good insight.
I appreciate it.
I think for now, I'll leave ice spear at 9, and rank thunder to 1 eventually and way after that I'll get them all to r1 when I'm near end game build.
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EndlessDreams wrote on 2010-06-29 16:35
Thunder because of its rafting purposes, which can allow you to get more mana herbs. It can also add more mana, which can sometimes allow you to raft without using mana pots from just using transformation. Ice Spear is only really good when you combine it with Blaze.
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Justified wrote on 2010-06-29 22:42
Quote from EndlessDreams;79067:
Thunder because of its rafting purposes, which can allow you to get more mana herbs. It can also add more mana, which can sometimes allow you to raft without using mana pots from just using transformation. Ice Spear is only really good when you combine it with Blaze.
Ice Spear damage is underrated. Modded Crown Ice Wand plus full charges (11 seconds) can OHKO difficult mobs (Ciar Advance boss, Peaca Wights, etc) while loading the fastest out of all three magics. I concur with Yogurt, Fireball is basically THE magic to use for hectic party runs.
imo, either get BOTH Ice Spear and Fireball (Ice Spear shines in solo play, Fireball will dominate party),
or get Thunder (median between the speed of Ice Spear and the power of Fireball).
And just for the record, after starting to raft myself for Mana Herbs, I can say it's easy to get any given amount of stars using Ice Spear. A little bit trickier than Thunder yes, but that kind of eliminates the incentive there.
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rinaek wrote on 2010-07-01 19:54
If you're worried about having high CP, I would get Ice Spear. It hardly affects it, and it's an awesome skill at rank 1. However, if you're not going to go all the way to rank 1, then get Thunder, since anything under rank 1 for Ice Spear is not so good.
As for rafting, yes, you can raft with Ice Spear, it's much harder, and I find that it uses more mana than rank 6 thunder while being less consistent with the stars it nets me. If you're rafting for explore exp, in that you're going for as many kills as possible, ice spear is fine. But if you're shooting for a certain item, like ingots, then the chain explosions of ice spear really throw you off, since sometimes they kill a lot, sometimes only a few, and sometimes not at all. It's really annoying to go over the stars you need because that last chain did a crit.
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Justified wrote on 2010-07-01 20:37
Quote from rinaek;80316:
If you're worried about having high CP, I would get Ice Spear. It hardly affects it, and it's an awesome skill at rank 1. However, if you're not going to go all the way to rank 1, then get Thunder, since anything under rank 1 for Ice Spear is not so good.
As for rafting, yes, you can raft with Ice Spear, it's much harder, and I find that it uses more mana than rank 6 thunder while being less consistent with the stars it nets me. If you're rafting for explore exp, in that you're going for as many kills as possible, ice spear is fine. But if you're shooting for a certain item, like ingots, then the chain explosions of ice spear really throw you off, since sometimes they kill a lot, sometimes only a few, and sometimes not at all. It's really annoying to go over the stars you need because that last chain did a crit.
Do you have Rank 1 Ice Spear? Your sig says Rank 2.
For Ice Spear, Rank 1 is really a must. The width of the shot makes a huuuuuuge difference.
As far as splash goes, I've never had problems with it. The main problem is the Ice Magic Shield users which will completely screw you over if you don't firebolt them first (or freeze them before they start casting). Otherwise, it's pretty much exactly the same as doing one-charge Thunder, one shot hits the clump of four targets exactly the same.
If you use the best mana reduction wand upgrades for both spells, Ice Spear will use less by a small margin. Not sure if it's worth the extra work, but I wouldn't use rafting as the excuse to say Thunder is more practical. (Except on the second leg, as steering gets a little tricky there if you haven't practiced it).
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Odinwolfe wrote on 2010-07-04 00:22
Once again, very good insight from you all.
For now, I'm going to rank Thunder as high as possible. granted I don't lose interest like I did last time.
Just....385 AP is ALOT when you can't rebirth weekly like many people.
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Yogurticecream wrote on 2010-07-04 02:38
You could rank all three up slowly, depending on your interest in the spell.
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Odinwolfe wrote on 2010-07-07 06:44
Well today I bought 6 RB cards.
I calculated I'll have enough AP to get rank 1 at the end with some spare.
Each life I get to level 50 (minimum) and 13 exploration. minimum.
Since I've gotten a bit stronger, and tara missions are easy. I can train much easier now so my minimum might raise a bit.
So that's 62 AP per rebirth. not much, I know. but I can't play as much as I'd like.
also what's cool is I can just rank it as I go, to rank 6 at least. since I deranked it a while back to finish AR since i'm an archer.
I'll be happy to have rank 1 Thunder. I think fireball can wait, and ice spear will get to 1 way later.
Thanks for the advice. Now I'll try to get rid of this headache.
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rinaek wrote on 2010-07-08 21:07
Quote from Justified;80329:
Do you have Rank 1 Ice Spear? Your sig says Rank 2.
For Ice Spear, Rank 1 is really a must. The width of the shot makes a huuuuuuge difference.
As far as splash goes, I've never had problems with it. The main problem is the Ice Magic Shield users which will completely screw you over if you don't firebolt them first (or freeze them before they start casting). Otherwise, it's pretty much exactly the same as doing one-charge Thunder, one shot hits the clump of four targets exactly the same.
If you use the best mana reduction wand upgrades for both spells, Ice Spear will use less by a small margin. Not sure if it's worth the extra work, but I wouldn't use rafting as the excuse to say Thunder is more practical. (Except on the second leg, as steering gets a little tricky there if you haven't practiced it).
Haha, I forgot to update signature. Yeah, it's been rank 1 for a while now.
Actually, the main reason I found rafting harder with ice spear is because ice spear puts you in range of easily getting shot by archers, which pretty much interrupts everything and throws you off. And if you use your ice spear on the archers, you won't have enough time to load up 2 charges and spear the warriors while they stand in a straight line. And if you miss the warriors, get on one the raft, you'll be shot in the rear be the next cluster of archers while dealing with that warrior (this was before blaze, though; blaze handles those warriors quite well, although getting shot still means gg for me).
On the second leg, I could never get 16 stars with ice spear, while I can consistently do so with thunder.
To OP, good luck as a mage. Best get used to rafting. Memorize the spawns, get a speedcast thunder wand, and an MP reduction set.
And don't forget the Blaze, that's always a good skill to have.
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Odinwolfe wrote on 2010-07-09 03:36
Quote from rinaek;86134:
Haha, I forgot to update signature. Yeah, it's been rank 1 for a while now.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Quote omitted for length~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
To OP, good luck as a mage. Best get used to rafting. Memorize the spawns, get a speedcast thunder wand, and an MP reduction set.
And don't forget the Blaze, that's always a good skill to have.
Firstly, thanks for the input.
I can solo raft and get 12 big stars with rank 9 Thunder, is this good?
I sold the speed L-wand I had, when I was broke.
Also, do you make your own potions? My potion skill is balls, although my wife is ranking her potion skill currently.
Mana herbs are relatively easy to obtain as i can make them with synthesis and gather them from pets/ dungeons.
Any advice on the potion situation? I don't exactly have 2m to blow on herbs to rank the skill myself.
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Kazuni wrote on 2010-07-09 05:15
Quote from Odinwolfe;84203:
Well today I bought 6 RB cards.
I calculated I'll have enough AP to get rank 1 at the end with some spare.
Each life I get to level 50 (minimum) and 13 exploration. minimum.
Since I've gotten a bit stronger, and tara missions are easy. I can train much easier now so my minimum might raise a bit.
So that's 62 AP per rebirth. not much, I know. but I can't play as much as I'd like.
also what's cool is I can just rank it as I go, to rank 6 at least. since I deranked it a while back to finish AR since i'm an archer.
I'll be happy to have rank 1 Thunder. I think fireball can wait, and ice spear will get to 1 way later.
Thanks for the advice. Now I'll try to get rid of this headache.
You don't get full training if you rank it again.
Wiki:
If you use a skill reset capsule to reset a skill, it will be reset at maximum training exp, but you will not gain full training exp from ranking it again.
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Justified wrote on 2010-07-09 05:19
Quote from Kazuni;86574:
You don't get full training if you rank it again.
Wiki:
Full training exp refers to the experience point bonus you get when ranking the skill.
Meaning, the bonus that nobody pays attention to because it doesn't help at all - until Rank 1 where you get a Master Title.
Indeed you can rank straight through the skill after resetting it.