[Mabinogi-JP] Regeneration Update / Ninjas

• Kapra wrote on 2014-07-04 21:54

  Quote from Osu;1230040:

  (granted the claims of a 2.33x multiplier at full charge are accurate)

  
  No charging at rN gives 150% damage and at r1 gives 430%. In addition, there are two multipliers that do not vary with rank. At first charge, you get a 175% multiplier. At second charge, you get a 200% multiplier. (I am unsure if the 200% replaces the 175% or stacks.)
• wilson10000 wrote on 2014-07-04 22:09

  Quote from Kaeporo;1230102:

  The whole talent is pretty bugged right now. DevCat doesn't know how to fix the missing issue.
  
  Two-handed weapons that receive one-handed special upgrades and reforges. Meh.
  
  Charging Shuriken
  - Highly damaging smash variant
  - Occasionally misses or hits several seconds late
  
  Shadow Assault
  - 51 cooldown w/3 second duration; knocks targets back 1200 units
  - Wind Blast/Hide combination, useful when it's available...which it rarely is
  
  Ground Snare
  - Beats out Shooting Rush for "glitchiest skill ever"
  - Potentially useful against large bosses
  - Appropriate damage/cooldown
  - OP reforge
  
  Kunai Rush
  - Most important ninja skill
  - Stronger windmill w/reduced AOE and longer cooldown
  
  Hazy Smokescreen
  - Worthless
  - Proves DevCat either has zero fucking idea what's up OR that ninja is meant for the weakest of beginners, despite depending on two stats...see point 1
  
  Shadow Bind
  - Potentially useful; limited target count and duration hurts
  - Super OP reforge
  
  Sakura Shower
  - 20 min cooldown
  - Meteor Strike tier

  
  
  Interesting, I would like to know why Ground Snare and Shadow Bind have the most op reforges.
  
  Which location are the reforges at?
• RegisAreus wrote on 2014-07-04 22:54
  When ninja comes out, can anyone in Alexina make me the blacksmith one please? xD
• Twin wrote on 2014-07-05 02:37

  Quote from Osu;1230040:

  I think there's something seriously wrong with the majority of you, rofl.

  
  Saying something is wrong with people because they have different opinions? well that's pretty rude.
  
  

  Quote from Osu;1230040:

  Main thing I can say if you're disappointed with ninja damage.. stop watching the one video in this thread~ that person has nothing r1, guaranteed.

  
  
  Truth be told,the main problem with Ninja isn't its damage,it's just poorly done as fresh talent to offer something new. Depends on your opinion still.To me however, it could use some tweeks...everywhere. Only interesting thing left about Ninja is the modifiers for different races,which at this point seems like rumor.
  
  

  Quote from Osu;1230040:

  Damage aside though, ninja seems to have something to use in any situation, if you combine it with melee, which~ since you use str and all, is very doable haha.

  
  Glitches,choppy game-play, and reasonable damage aside though, Ninja seems to offer minor debuffs and stun skills almost better than stun pets. Not complaining..that's pretty much what I see.
  
  

  Quote from Osu;1230040:

  Plus I'll just throw this out there.. with good stats and medicore gear, rasenzan is easily capable of 15k damage(granted the claims of a 2.33x multiplier at full charge are accurate), and that's without reforges. How many skillsets can really say that? Just gunner basically, yeah? And that's an 800% damage skill rofl.

  
  Ha, you're pretty funny.Gunner cannot say that easily because Gunner requires 1. Good guns (debatable due to amount of INT and STR) 2. Good stats (high INT and STR near 1k each to make use of 800% multiplier for lower damaging guns) 3.Good ranks (which again, just good INT and STR wins still because Gunner's main multipliers are fairly low.EX; Shooting Rush and unless mobs are close together Bullet Storm) in other words, you need to put in a lot of AP and time into gunner to reach N.I (Nuke It) status.
  
  From how you make Rasenzan sound, it can make anyone OP with little to no effort.Gunner 5/INT & STR 800% (some guns are very low damaging) Ninja 4/STR & WILL (adds for more damage) 400% x 2.33 = 932% Rasenzan Multiplier,without reforges. Would be best to compare your example to Puppeteer.
  
  

  Quote from Osu;1230040:

  All that aside. It looks freaking fun as hell. That's what I most look forward to with this. Something to help me enjoy the game again basically, instead of treating it like a job or a nuisance when something doesn't go right.
  
  But hey I like my ideals to be unique as well, so less of you being ninja out there, the better for me. 83

  
  I'm sure the 10's of people maining Ninja will feel very special..
• Lingshen wrote on 2014-07-05 02:53
  Uh, Rasenzan isn't a very good comparison to Puppetry. Puppetry has high multipliers and is AoE orientated; You can use 3 AoEs in a row with one that can hit more than once. Rasenzan on the other hand, if you don't charge it at all it only hits one target, with a rather small AoE range. Unsure if the AoE only applies if you charge it though. A better comparison would be Martial Arts don't you think.
  
  I'm gonna be in that '10s' of people so... Yeah, I will feel pretty special.
• Kapra wrote on 2014-07-05 06:02
  Osu, Twin, don't start another one, both of you. If you are going to argue utility, you can do so without mocking others.
• Zeo wrote on 2014-07-05 06:03
  [video=youtubeold;l5Yunb992zk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5Yunb992zk[/video]
  
  I lol'd at the part about it being based off str/will because I can agree it's ridiculous.
• willcaster wrote on 2014-07-05 07:02

  Quote from Zeo;1230171:

  [video=youtubeold;l5Yunb992zk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5Yunb992zk[/video]
  
  I lol'd at the part about it being based off str/will because I can agree it's ridiculous.

  
  
  training requirments are too ._. they should give u an easy way and a hardcore way (easy kill boss mosnters for noobies, hardcore kill 50k mosnters like they are doing)
  
  Why not a freaking school system with boss mosnters and such ._. paying x amount of gold according to ur CP
• RegisAreus wrote on 2014-07-05 07:20

  Quote from Zeo;1230171:

  [video=youtubeold;l5Yunb992zk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5Yunb992zk[/video]
  
  I lol'd at the part about it being based off str/will because I can agree it's ridiculous.

  
  I laughed at the str+will part to xD makes so much sense. I need a blacksmith to make me those stars doe!
• EndlessDreams wrote on 2014-07-05 07:23

  Quote from Zeo;1230171:

  [video=youtubeold;l5Yunb992zk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5Yunb992zk[/video]
  
  I lol'd at the part about it being based off str/will because I can agree it's ridiculous.

  
  
  Nice to see it isn't based on combat power again...
  But that is some insane grind...
• EndlessDreams wrote on 2014-07-05 07:24

  Quote from Zeo;1230171:

  [video=youtubeold;l5Yunb992zk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5Yunb992zk[/video]
  
  I lol'd at the part about it being based off str/will because I can agree it's ridiculous.

  
  
  Nice to see it isn't based on combat power again...
  But that is some insane grind...
• Ryufujibayashi wrote on 2014-07-05 07:35

  Quote from Zeo;1230171:

  [video=youtubeold;l5Yunb992zk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5Yunb992zk[/video]
  
  I lol'd at the part about it being based off str/will because I can agree it's ridiculous.

  
  
  I don't really feel like it's ridiculous being str/will if we're talking historical ninja terms. but for balancing purposes in the game sure. I feel this way because the only thing you needed to know to be a ninja was Ninjutsu. Ninjutsu is the only art that was exclusive to the ninja, it did not require dexterity or strength to use Ninjutsu, nor intelligence... you just had to know how to use it. throwing shuriken and kunai is shuriken jutsu and not exclusive to the ninja. However on a historical scale it's silly that giants get to benefit from it most because Ninja couldn't be over 130 lbs. At first I was disappointed about the str/will thing, but at this point I just want to play the skill set no matter what. True ninja mentality is not to dwell on the ghosts of the past but to utilize what little you have in moving forward in the path that lies before you.
• Bunny wrote on 2014-07-05 08:13
  [FONT="Arial"]Friendly reminder to everyone that debates are fine, but don't go insulting each other or even implying it. It is unnecessary.
  
  If someone is wrong or misinformed, you can correct them in a nice manner rather than use a condescending/derogatory tone.[/FONT]
• Rydian wrote on 2014-07-05 12:10
  Honestly I'd rather the training be based on CP like a lot of other skills are because it means faster training is possible.
  
  Yes, I know a lot of you oldbies might be curling up into fetal positions over Windmill training memories, but Windmill is an outlier. Most CP-based skills can be trained much faster than the skills that simply want you to spam them at least 500 times per rank (aren't some of the ninja ones like 1000-4000?) because most CP-based skills allow you to hit 100 total points in a much smaller number of uses.
  
  

  • Arrow Revolver can be trained from R5+ with <50 kills per rank.
    
  • Crossbow Mastery can be trained from R5->R3 with <70 kills per rank, then 100 or less per rank.
    
  • Final Hit can be trained from R5+ with a single use of the skill each rank, if properly prepared.
    
  • Fireball can be trained from R5->R3 with <50 kills per rank, then from R3+ with ~100 kills per rank.
    
  • Fusion Bolt can be trained from R5->R2 with <50 kills per rank, then R2+ with ~100 kills per rank.
    
  • Ice Spear can be trained from R5+ with ~75 kills per rank.
    
  • Lance Mastery can be trained from R5->R2 with <50 kills per rank, then R2 needs like 120.
    
  • Ranged Attack (Human) can be trained from R5+ with <50 kills per rank.
    
  • Thunder can be trained from R5->R4 with <50 kills per rank, then R3+ with ~75 kills per rank.
    (And that's not all of them, of course.)
    

  
  I would much rather have options like that available (being able to train the skill in a relatively-small number of uses with the right preparation) than the only option being to use the skill on any-CP enemy until my hand falls off.
  
  "But most of that training needs you to kill Boss enemies and those are a fairy tale and don't exist!" - The Other Alchemist spawns Golems with CP 7200 starting from the first room (and higher ones in the later rooms). If your CP is 2399 or less, they're easy access to boss-level enemies. If you need a bit more the Demonic Ghouls and such in Episode 2's Mailbox Mission are 8000 CP, meaning you can use them for boss if you're 2665 or less.
  
  And hey, if you already are OP to the point that you can't hit 2665 CP even with all the -CP gear out there (a Raccoon Cub suit is not the only -CP gear FFS), then you can still train on them as Awful (which is still enough to fully train) until your CP hits 4K!
  
  And if you have 4K CP even with all your -CP gear on... then you probably aren't in heavy need of this skillset to kill anything anyways!
• Aubog007 wrote on 2014-07-05 12:58
  From the way i look at it, the lower the AP, the harder it should be to train.
  
  Newer skills of course, not the old skills, heck i think the older skills should get their AP adjusted.