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Zekkii wrote on 2014-10-15 10:05
So before you read on, I have to warn you that this is fairly negative, so turn back now if you don't want to hear it. It's also a bit lengthy.
[spoiler=Update Concerns]Seems like every update is one of four things now, especially the first:
• New clothes gacha
• Events
• New skills
• Saga
So far it seems pretty normal. The concerns are related to the older content, and how years of almost entirely these four types of updates have effected them. I'll try not to make this sound like venting/ranting.
First off is the gachas, oh the gachas. Clothes are harmless additions to Mabi, and I can't find too many reasons to discourage frequent clothing gachas. Fashionogis like clothes and spend lots of money on gacha to get them, so it's become a major part of Nexon's monetezation. So why is this a bad thing, and how does it relate to content? It actually has very little to do with clothes, aside from totally destroying and neglecting usefulness of tailoring. It's all the other items that get bundled in with clothes; r1 items, enchants, weaponry, and virtually every item drop that someone might consider picking up from a dungeon or shadow mission. In short, Gachapons are the main reason why rewards for content are generally useless aside from gold and exp. Most recent example is pianos, but also note all of the things that could have been content rewards which were instead released for gachas.
Next we have events. I'm sure many players love events. They keep the game lively and help bring people together, or at least they should. In some regards they do help, and I have tried to enjoy events for at least their premieres. However the first issue I've had with events is the development time usage. A lot of time was put into events such as Cursed Labyrinth and Doki Doki Island, amongst a stream of smaller events. This is one of the main reasons why very little permanent playable content being released, which was rather poorly thought out anyways. The second major problem with events is poor prevention of exploitation, which results in events being over-rewarding. Find Caravan Joe, Hot Times, Dressing Room Event, and dozens more just waiting to give you a reward unproportionate to your effort, and your 100 alts too. I'm sure many players remember the Liar event, although I'd like to forget. Along with steams of DR/training exp events, these events are cheapening permanent content. I don't really care for AFK events, but that's a subject for another thread.
Thirdly is the new skills. At first I never thought I'd complain about new skills, but it's been an ugly trend for a while now; every new skillset has to have some new game-breaking ability to be piled onto the already-easy content we have now. I get that Nexon is trying to give high-level players something to rank, but the things we can do are just getting more and more ridiculous. Did we really need 300 more of every stat, catering, singing, hydra, or crisis escape? The quality of skills, in my eyes, is declining. Skills are also consuming a large portion of the development budget. The new skills are also fairly grindy and lead into some p2w stuff, but that's a bit off-topic.
Finally we have saga. I don't really like saga's writing or gameplay. It doesn't really drop the game's quality though, I can just ignore it or player it once and forget about it. Saga probably takes whatever is left of the budget though.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Summary]To summarize my opinion:
1. Gachapons centralize rewards as well as new items to themselves
2. Events cheapen normal gameplay
3. Constant skills take whatever hope of challenge was left, out
4. Saga is meh[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Afterthoughts]It would be difficult to create challenging, rewarding, and fun content at this point. In many regards this is a problem for high-level players, but I think it turns off a lot of new players too.
In regards to fashion in Mabinogi, I do enjoy it. However the game is leaning toward being just another clothing simulator, when there's no reason it shouldn't have solid combat as well.[/spoiler]
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Kaeporo wrote on 2014-10-15 10:32
DevCat/Nexon's current strategy is not good for the health of Mabinogi. There isn't any end-game (challenging/rewarding) content for higher level players which has led to a metric fuck ton of them quitting. Newer players (those who make it past the initial hurdles) recognize that there isn't any real reason to play as their effort will be made quickly redundant. Why rank life skills? Gacha ruined the value of products. Why rank combat skills? Gacha ruined rewards; not to mention 95% of content can be cleared just as easily at 2k as it can be at 15k.
As stated, I've seen a ton of players quit recently. The whales of Mabinogi need other fish to swim with. Nexon needs to change up their tactics before this spirals out of control. They've stacked their deck with events and gachapon; when that hand eventually folds, all of Mabinogi will fold with it.
The divine knight update? Bah. It adds one new boss fight, a mainstream where they repeat that boss fight, and lucky special upgrade stones.
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Daakun wrote on 2014-10-15 10:57
I agree on some fronts (what made them think crisis escape was a good idea, and why doesn't hydra put you into hide's combat cooldown?) but the biggest problem hit ages ago and isn't likely to ever change back.
Everything but magic and some alchemy skills are instant load, and they pretend skill cooldowns make up for it. In reality, everyone instantly became a thousand times stronger and safer.
Back in the day running Peaca solo was considered lunacy by most, nowadays I can do it on my tertiary skillsets for kicks when I'm bored simply because counter and windmill are instant load.
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Osayidan wrote on 2014-10-15 11:36
I also feel there's just no point continuing, all I was doing every day is dragon raid, maybe some rafting and nature reserve nuking. Just hoarding up AP while working on the meteor strike master title. I haven't really played since the end of summer, since the attendance event ended, and don't really feel a need to. If I notice a exp/rainbow/ap event I'd probably play a bit if it's a weekend just out of habit, but that's it.
Not even interested in saga 2.
In my case not only is there lack of fun content, but the content people do consider fun seems to be made for overpowered people who dedicated their mabinogi careers to maxing out every point of damage possible. Monsters have too much HP, it's boring as fuck. I rather deal with challening/interesting AI and unique abilities than just tossing my mana at a giant wall of HP. Challenging content doesn't mean "oh... give more HP to those mobs that should last them a few months".
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Kaeporo wrote on 2014-10-15 11:54
Quote from Osayidan;1251073:
I also feel there's just no point continuing, all I was doing every day is dragon raid, maybe some rafting and nature reserve nuking. Just hoarding up AP while working on the meteor strike master title. I haven't really played since the end of summer, since the attendance event ended, and don't really feel a need to. If I notice a exp/rainbow/ap event I'd probably play a bit if it's a weekend just out of habit, but that's it.
Not even interested in saga 2.
In my case not only is there lack of fun content, but the content people do consider fun seems to be made for overpowered people who dedicated their mabinogi careers to maxing out every point of damage possible. Monsters have too much HP, it's boring as fuck. I rather deal with challening/interesting AI and unique abilities than just tossing my mana at a giant wall of HP. Challenging content doesn't mean "oh... give more HP to those mobs that should last them a few months".
It's not even made for those people.
Your total level and equipment don't mean shit to the white and black dragon raids. They barely matter when the server gets together to blitz the desert/red dragons. The only content released nowadays fails because it has horrible quality produced by people who have no fucking clue how Mabinogi works.
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Kingofrunes wrote on 2014-10-15 16:37
To be honest, I'm honestly surprised Mabinogi has survived in KR for over 10 years, especially during it's many many many slow periods. The Koreans have had to endure more update dry spells than the NA community has. What has taken us 6 years to get, KR got in 10 years. Think about that for a moment.
That being said, there really isn't much left in Mabinogi for me these days so I mostly play other games and come back to Mabi to do the odd event, get the odd event/gacha shiny and otherwise participate in the new content until I finish it get bored with ranking the skills due to them being way too repetitive and grindy.
Basically only thing keeping me coming back to mabi is the shiny things they throw out in the gacha and cash shop. No shinies or update? No money from me Nexon.
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ironwoman wrote on 2014-10-15 17:30
I know I said this before but I'm gonna say it here again.
This is mainly because players' goals, especially the high leveled players, have changed. In the old days, it would be to clear contents, the harder ones, etc. Now, since players can literally 5 shot a Red dragon, there aren't many challenging contents. Now it's more about who can do the higher damage.
Hence why it came to this: gachapons releasing pre-reforged items, skills that give more stats, items that give more raw power (bhafel combo, hello)
And the game updates consistently made it much easier for newer players. Think about it, easier AP, easier training, faster rebirth, etc. The problem lies in the fact that there are not many newer combat-related content to remedy this.
As for me, the other skills I have left to rank are pretty grindy ones, so I'll just start being active again when there is a training event.
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Gaby5011 wrote on 2014-10-15 18:50
I'm bad with words, so I'll just say that I agree with you all. In the past week or so I've probably played only 1 or 2 hours total. Did SS HM solo (would've do elite if I had a pass (OP players, toplel)) for the daily, hung around a bit and that's it.
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Kelvas wrote on 2014-10-15 19:40
I've lost most of my interest in Mabinogi, especially with the updates.
Even though I've played for a little while, I have only completed Gen 1,2,3, 10, and Saga I. I've done parts of g8, and g9 and hamlet. That's about it. There's no motivation for me to do them, the rewards aren't worth the time.
I used to EvG with friends back in my newbie days, but after trying it again for the first time in four months, I've realized that I have zero interest left in that; it's just a waste of time and durability, and I can't see why I thought it was fun in my early mabi life.
I know this is a bit off topic, but relates to my loss of interest - my guild is basically dead, and the interest and activities of the members are completely different from mine. There's rarely anything in the guild chat. All I do is MA at this point, and I never go with my guild as a. there's no puppeteer, b. I'm the only decent blazer, and c. none of us are particularly strong. It's just easier to go with friends as oppose to guildies. The only thing that seems fun anymore is MA to gain levels quickly.
My typical mabinogi day:
Do SM dailies
*Do events for the sole purpose of certain rewards
Do saga I ep 10
Run MA if I have time
Log off or go AFK
*If the event is too long, I won't do it. These events mean absolutely nothing unless there are training seals, reforges, and/or APs involve. I don't enjoy the event, I'm only in for the rewards. I wish they would do a big update on the game engine itself, but we all know they won't.
Interest in Mabi last year: 10/10
Interest now: 5/10
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JADT wrote on 2014-10-15 20:59
Mabinogi needs runescape's approach to doing quests.
Keeping quests to events, skills and generations only degrades how much content is actually in the game. Also having everything revolve around shadow missions doesn't help either. Scenarios can be made instanced without having a trippy shadow mission.
I don't really see mabinogi growing much further than it has. Come g20, the game might just cease to exist or become a stagnant mess that not even devcat will have any integrity to clean up after.
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Kingofrunes wrote on 2014-10-15 21:59
Quote from JADT;1251123:
Mabinogi needs runescape's approach to doing quests.
Keeping quests to events, skills and generations only degrades how much content is actually in the game. Also having everything revolve around shadow missions doesn't help either. Scenarios can be made instanced without having a trippy shadow mission.
I don't really see mabinogi growing much further than it has. Come g20, the game might just cease to exist or become a stagnant mess that not even devcat will have any integrity to clean up after.
I've always gone on and on about Runecape's quest system and I honestly believe in it. There's just so many quests and more are constantly being added and created, each with their own bit of lore. Then again Runescape as a whole does the whole lore thing correct, with pretty well written quests for the most part.
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Darkboy132 wrote on 2014-10-15 22:00
I just want to stick the middle finger up gachapons, useless events, and saga... A lot of new skills seem really lazy-mode ish.
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Osayidan wrote on 2014-10-15 22:05
I'll just be playing PSO2 until we get some rewarding or AP/exp events.
Deep down I still want to enjoy the game because it has so much potential, but it's become too repetitive and doesn't cater well to anyone except new players. One can argue it does a little bit for so called "end game" players with the hardest of the hard shadow missions but I'm sure most disagree, and then everyone in the middle has nothing but grinding to look forward to.
I feel like logging into mabi is work, or some kind of obligation so I don't miss out on things, rather than being fun.
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EndlessDreams wrote on 2014-10-15 22:16
All the events have to be based on the current mechanics of the current game in NA and/or KR Mabinogi. It will be really hard to completely invent an event that requires completely new mechanics not found in any version of Mabinogi. For example, you can't really make Mabinogi jump freely like in some of the modern MMORPGs without changing something fundamental in the game.
Gacha-pattern is found in a lot of modern MMORPG games nowadays. Most of it doesn't really affect game-play.
But people complain about wanting end-game for Mabinogi. However, what is that supposed to be? It already takes far more time to get to end-game in Mabinogi than practically all the other current MMORPG in the market. Some of the same types of dungeon that follows the same restrictive and boring game mechanics?
While I agree on some degree that Mabinogi had the potential... but lets face the reality:
1) Mabinogi is an old game. Graphics/Combat system is very outdated.
2) It has only been recently people go free 1 week rebirths. Even then, it takes a very long time to make progress in Mabinogi. Most of the time is spent waiting for rebirths, which means not playing.
3) It isn't a popular game, at all. That means that there is less incentive for a company to keep developing this game, which also mean that there is less people wanting to stick around.
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Darkboy132 wrote on 2014-10-15 22:18
I really wish they made mobs smarter, not bulkier. I duo'd Duke once because my friend's friend wanted to trio Peaca Abyss, he d/ced in the third room. Duke killed us a few times ONLY because of the one-shot, but other than that it was extremely unentertaining.
Mobs need to be off steroids, and need to stop possessing ONLY basic skills. Why are there so many warrior mobs, archer mobs without crash shot, or mages with only bolt spells? That's just lazy and poor. Mobs shouldn't be "quick and merciless"; rather it's best they torture with a slow and painful death, combined with an intelligent AI they'd stop anyone from saving that person getting combo'd to death.