Thoughts about Alban Knight Training Camp?

• Rydian wrote on 2015-07-27 02:07
  - Likes
  

  • Actual rewards.
    The dungeon gives things that players of varying types want and can reasonably obtain. Upgrade stones are common, I see enchants now and then too, you get gold and EXP and Crusader EXP, can make a custom totem, and potentially more that aren't listed yet. It's like dungeon plus mission rewards with drop rates that aren't insane for basic things, and minus the 50-gold NPC crap.
    
    
    
    
  • A variety of places to fight in.
    It's scenery changes, and it has more possible rooms than there are rooms per run, so it'll take you 2 or 3 runs to see all the rooms. It also includes one of the previously-unused battle arenas, giving a use for it now. All of them are re-used instances of other areas in-game, but the variety and random factor means it's nicer than the standard Tara castle rooms over and over. Also being able to use props and walls for cover is nice, opens up tactics you don't get to use in SMs.
    
    
    
    
  • The boss is fun to fight.
    I actively enjoy fighting the boss because it's not cheap in the terms of other things. It doesn't have AHS (unlike other Mabi things), it doesn't automatically one-shot people (too many examples to count), and it doesn't spend 90% of the fight literally invulnerable (ugh Warframe bosses). It's described as a "golem" but it's actually styled after a colossus puppet so it's neat to look at too. It's still a boss, so it can still kill you and you need tactics and stuff, but it's more interesting than most other bosses in Mabi.

  
  
  
  - Dislikes
  

  • Insta-aggro.
    You think other mobs aggro fast? Oh no no this takes it to the next level. Sometimes the second wave will spawn in and I'm suddenly getting smashed by a balrog that hasn't even shown up on screen. Literally the last enemy of the first wave dies and I'm suddenly in the "Oh shit I'm getting wrecked" animation before the monster's model even shows up.
    
    I agree that in harder difficulties mobs should aggro faster than normal, but this cranks it up to 11 and takes some of the fun out of it. There's no tactics or skill or strength involved when the enemy can attack before the player knows they exist.
    
    Lullaby doesn't help this much, since a monster must have existed when you started Lullaby for it to be considered a possible target when the effect triggers a second or two later. So starting to sing before the monsters spawn in just wastes it.
    
    
    
    
  • Advanced Heavy Stander
    Cobweb mummies and perhaps others have this. They have a lower baseline level of strength (offense/defense) than other mobs so by themselves they're not the most dangerous, but the fact that they ignore stuns and movement limitations means they serve as deadly distractions for the archers and other monsters.
    
    Thankfully Lullaby still works, but I feel that spawning in 6+ mobs with AHS at once is cheap.
    
    
    
    
  • The distance from one room to another.
    Minor annoyance, but running around to the symbols constantly is meh. The non-boss rooms could stand to have their radius halved.
• ita wrote on 2015-07-27 03:23

  Quote from Rydian;1282836:

  it doesn't automatically one-shot people (too many examples to count)

  
  
  I can't think of any boss off the top of my head that one-shots you aside from the duke. The boss does instantly deadly you with most attacks it uses though, even with mana shield on.
• Kingofrunes wrote on 2015-07-27 03:36
  Only part about Alban Training Camp that really gets me is Heoric Mode. It took me and Kenero 4 hours to clear it and I used like 10 naos, got pot poisoned. Had to cheese the boss with final hit in the end >.>
  
  People who solo that for the Limit Breaker title are bloody insane. It would take me an entire day, 50 naos, and god knows how many pots I would need. It's mind boggling. Yet people have done it, as I've seen several people with the title.
  
  Upside is that Basic and Int aren't too bad to solo and have decent rewards. I'll try to solo adv next and see how that goes. I don't think I'd want to solo Hard though, and would rather run that with others.
  
  Heoric with 6 people also wouldn't be too bad either. 2 people, let alone solo Heoric is way too much effort and energy for any reward to be worth it.
• Darkboy132 wrote on 2015-07-27 03:50

  Quote from ita;1282838:

  I can't think of any boss off the top of my head that one-shots you aside from the duke. The boss does instantly deadly you with most attacks it uses though, even with mana shield on.

  
  
  Girgashiy can one shot. Master Lich also comes really, really close to one-shotting.
  
  Duke's one-shot mechanic can be cleansed with Pegasus's summon-on effect.
• Rynn wrote on 2015-07-27 04:15

  Quote from Kingofrunes;1282840:

  People who solo that for the Limit Breaker title are bloody insane. It would take me an entire day, 50 naos, and god knows how many pots I would need. It's mind boggling. Yet people have done it, as I've seen several people with the title.

  
  
  It took me 2.5 hours and literally only really used one skill: firebolt. I think you have good focus on that skill so you should be fine.
  
  You just hit an orb, r1 shadow cloak outside of aggro range and then you just firebolt for 2 hours and a half. Fireball/snapcast/fireball/crisis escape once a minute helps if you're into that.
  
  It's not really impossible or insane, it's just really really really boring and consumes a lot of mana/resources but hey you only really need to do it once for the title so go for it!
• ita wrote on 2015-07-27 07:17

  Quote from Darkboy132;1282841:

  Girgashiy can one shot. Master Lich also comes really, really close to one-shotting.
  
  Duke's one-shot mechanic can be cleansed with Pegasus's summon-on effect.

  
  
  I was mainly thinking about dungeon bosses, since Girg is a "raid" boss. Might as well include BD and its stomp then. Master lich isn't too bad, it doesn't always one-shot. I'm aware you can negate the duke's attack, but it still has the ability to one-shot you. The Alban golem can very easily one shot you with most of its skills. A majority of the time you will instant deadly if you are hit by it, in heroic I mean.
  
  

  Quote from Rynn;1282842:

  It took me 2.5 hours and literally only really used one skill: firebolt.

  
  
  Mind if I ask what your stats and reforges are when using your wand? 2.5 hours is pretty impressive.
• Kingofrunes wrote on 2015-07-27 10:51

  Quote from Rynn;1282842:

  It took me 2.5 hours and literally only really used one skill: firebolt. I think you have good focus on that skill so you should be fine.
  
  You just hit an orb, r1 shadow cloak outside of aggro range and then you just firebolt for 2 hours and a half. Fireball/snapcast/fireball/crisis escape once a minute helps if you're into that.
  
  It's not really impossible or insane, it's just really really really boring and consumes a lot of mana/resources but hey you only really need to do it once for the title so go for it!

  
  
  I suppose I'll give that a shot. Forgot about shadow cloak, I should use that more. I do love my fireball + crisis escape.
  
  The main concern is the rooms with the god awful camera angles where I can't see shit and accidentally wander into aggro range. Also will need a few ego repair wands going in because that ate through 30 dura of my ego wand real fast.
  
  Although the Golem is the going to be the tricky part as well, but a few naos and final hit spam should do the trick if I pet attack it until it switches to red.
  
  I still have doubts on it taking 2.5 hours though. I suppose I didn't overture as much as I could have when I ran it. You sure you didn't add any modifiers to make that easier?
• Fracture wrote on 2015-07-27 13:29

  Quote from Rydian;1282836:

  
  

  The distance from one room to another.
  Minor annoyance, but running around to the symbols constantly is meh. The non-boss rooms could stand to have their radius halved.

  
  
  Fuck, please. This is the only change I need made to this dungeon. It's made worse by how often this place just sort of arbitrarily desummons your pets, meaning I'm constantly cycling through mounts like crazy. If there was something to do in the opening rooms, maybe it'd be cool, but right now it's just a pointless chore to walk through a giant empty room over and over and over.
• Rynn wrote on 2015-07-27 13:59

  Quote from ita;1282847:

  Mind if I ask what your stats and reforges are when using your wand? 2.5 hours is pretty impressive.

  
  
  Lv 50 all spirit wand with casting speed 13 and firebolt dmg 19, meteor strike master/alo asuna, bolt mastery 20 hat and 1500 int (cater) and a SAO combo card are the only relevant magic things I have. A very significant part of my firebolt damage comes from 1500 STR (cater) and max damage enchants + battlefield overture which are more accessible to everyone.
  
  People don't really need all that however. Tribolt wands aren't THAT much worse than a spirit wand and gacha has pre-reforged ones, the rest is just stacking max damage enchants and having high character screen dmg + bfo and you'll get some good numbers. Stuff that gives % modifiers like bolt mastery reforge, combo card or hebona all do peanuts for firebolt due to mwm and diminishing returns so they're not really all that worth it.
  
  

  Quote from Kingofrunes;1282852:

  The main concern is the rooms with the god awful camera angles where I can't see shit and accidentally wander into aggro range. Also will need a few ego repair wands going in because that ate through 30 dura of my ego wand real fast.

  
  
  There's only one room where this is a problem, it's the one with walls that looks like some 2006 pvp area? I died like twice there because my screen was just black if I zoomed out too much. Other than that the only other annoying room I can think of is the Hillwen mine because I'm an idiot and I didn't know you could just go up the stairs to get out of aggro range...
  
  

  Quote from Kingofrunes;1282852:

  Although the Golem is the going to be the tricky part as well, but a few naos and final hit spam should do the trick if I pet attack it until it switches to red.

  
  
  As long as it doesn't glitch (1 dmg from everything besides hydra,etc) it's fairly easy. One trick is to let it summon stuff then lure it to a corner and die on purpose, then use a guardian stone from adventurer shop which will give you invulnerability. You can cast bfo, bone chip, etc in invulnerability and then kill it with final hit.
  
  

  Quote from Kingofrunes;1282852:

  I still have doubts on it taking 2.5 hours though. I suppose I didn't overture as much as I could have when I ran it. You sure you didn't add any modifiers to make that easier?

  
  
  I used 70% prot, but idk if that even does anything for firebolt since it goes off of magic prot but it didn't hurt so whatever. Would have used 70% hp stone but I think ironwoman scared everyone away from using those in case they are glitched.
• Twin wrote on 2015-07-27 14:03
  Mummies are a disappointment. No mob should ignore the combat system just to provide a challenge.
  
  Otherwise from what I seen, it's not totally bad. Still don't know much on the dungeon to give my full opinion though.
  
  Edit:
  

  Quote from Rynn;1282842:

  It's not really impossible or insane, it's just really really really boring and consumes a lot of mana/resources but hey you only really need to do it once for the title so go for it!

  
  
  So basically, this?
  
  [video=youtube;VhA2_g54OTw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhA2_g54OTw[/video]
• Qnjo wrote on 2015-07-27 14:05
  And so I went there for the first time and it's not exactly what I call fun. One would think that after this presumably big initiative to bring Mabinogi's complex combat system (which I personally love) back to grace, new content would actually encourage using it. Instead we get something that forces being cheap harder then ever. Rewards aside, I'm disappointed.
  
  Also, for the people complaining about the distance between rooms. It's literally just a few steps. I'd rather not partake in stereotypes about Americans but honestly, just how lazy are you?
• Rynn wrote on 2015-07-27 14:40

  Quote from Twin;1282857:

  So basically, this?
  
  [video=youtube;VhA2_g54OTw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhA2_g54OTw[/video]

  
  
  Yep, although with BFO instead of vivace (which is better for my build at least).
• Kingofrunes wrote on 2015-07-27 15:11

  Quote from Rynn;1282856:

  
  There's only one room where this is a problem, it's the one with walls that looks like some 2006 pvp area? I died like twice there because my screen was just black if I zoomed out too much. Other than that the only other annoying room I can think of is the Hillwen mine because I'm an idiot and I didn't know you could just go up the stairs to get out of aggro range...
  

  
  
  I can think of a couple other rooms that would be problematic. The Karu Boss room is absolutely obnoxious with it's camera angles that I can't figure out. As is the Belvast one. I will also agree on the Alby arena one. Hillwen one isn't too bad as yes, the stairs to make things easier.
  
  Other than that, I do have most of the things you were suggesting.
• callback wrote on 2015-07-27 16:09

  Quote from Rynn;1282856:

  Lv 50 all spirit wand with casting speed 13 and firebolt dmg 19, meteor strike master/alo asuna, bolt mastery 20 hat and 1500 int (cater) and a SAO combo card are the only relevant magic things I have. A very significant part of my firebolt damage comes from 1500 STR (cater) and max damage enchants + battlefield overture which are more accessible to everyone.
  
  People don't really need all that however. Tribolt wands aren't THAT much worse than a spirit wand and gacha has pre-reforged ones, the rest is just stacking max damage enchants and having high character screen dmg + bfo and you'll get some good numbers. Stuff that gives % modifiers like bolt mastery reforge, combo card or hebona all do peanuts for firebolt due to mwm and diminishing returns so they're not really all that worth it.
  
  I used 70% prot, but idk if that even does anything for firebolt since it goes off of magic prot but it didn't hurt so whatever. Would have used 70% hp stone but I think ironwoman scared everyone away from using those in case they are glitched.

  
  
  What kind of damage do you do normally with that (protless mobs)? I only get around 15k crits with an s5 savage wand, meteor/asuna, combo card, sung bfo, r1 applicable passives.
• Kingofrunes wrote on 2015-07-27 16:17

  Quote from callback;1282867:

  What kind of damage do you do normally with that (protless mobs)? I only get around 15k crits with an s5 savage wand, meteor/asuna, combo card, sung bfo, r1 applicable passives.

  
  
  I think I was able to hit 20k crits on Heoric with my Spirit Wand which isn't quite maxed. (high 40's for most stats though)
  
  My gear is all melee gear and my head piece has 20 bolt reforge. My spirit wand itself had 24 max firebolt reforge on it. This was with BFO at 33%