Abortion

• paladin wrote on 2010-06-04 01:48
  Am for it
  I would rather have the fetus termianted then have a child have to suffer the misery of a moth who donest or cant raise them
  Its either kill the fetus before it can have any basic living experince or let the child suffer the hardships and trauma of parents unable or not willing to raise them
  Pregrancy is also a long thing at 9 months and not one easy one either
  It costs alot of cash to raise kids and have the baby
• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-06-04 04:02
  BUT FETUS ARE HUMANS TOO.
  
  This equates to
  
  BUT SPERM ARE HUMANS TOO.
  
  This equates to
  
  STOP MASTURBATING DAMMIT.
• Forsaken wrote on 2010-06-04 04:07
  You just killed mostly every guys Nexon-downtime hobby.
• Osayidan wrote on 2010-06-04 04:10

  Quote from Forsaken;54264:

  You just killed mostly every guys Nexon-downtime hobby.

  
  Better than those who do it with their character loaded on the screen:scare:
• Everwanderer wrote on 2010-06-04 04:26
  I have very personal reasons to not like abortion, but in the end it's their choice and you have to respect that.
  
  I still believe this should'nt be taken lightly, so many idiots having sex and not taking responsability can't be a good thing. Yes, I'm aware of rape and abuse victims, but I'm not talkign about those tragic cases, no. I mean stupid people that go "Lol, guess i got pregnant darling, time to visit the abortion clinic again" Those kind of people should be put "asleep" along with their fetus.
• Kazuni wrote on 2010-06-04 04:42
  Someone I know from school is Christian. Like, super-super-Christian.
  She thinks abortion is like killing a real person, like, one who has already lived and experienced. She wouldn't believe me when I told her fetuses mostly aren't conscious during the period when abortions are possible.
  
  I asked her if she would prefer for the baby to be born and then put up for adoption, but she didn't agree, saying "the mother and father should take care of the child themselves because they're the cause for it."
  
  This kinda thing pisses me off, because she thinks the world isn't perfect enough. When she sees someone punch another person she'd always turn to the person beside her and inform them that hitting people was wrong, even when it was obviously play-fighting.
  
  I also know someone who's adopted. She hates the fact that she doesn't know who her parents were, and she doesn't understand why she wasn't good enough for them. When she's upset, she often says that she wishes that her mother had had an abortion. Yes, it might seem like she's pinning her problems on her parents who weren't there, but having no idea who your real parents are, and being bounced around between foster homes isn't easy for anyone.
  
  I asked my Christian friend what she would do if she was pregnant and had no resources to care for the child, and she replied "I wouldn't ever be pregnant if I wasn't ready for it. God will keep me safe."
  Usually at this point in an argument I would get pissed and leave. The "God will _____" thing gets to me. God will not do everything for you, you have to work for yourself, too.
  
  See, this is when religion gets too tied in with science. Sure, it gives people hope or whatever, but when it's affecting their judgement and views of other people and the choices they make which are considered "unethical or sinful", it's really going too far.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-06-04 04:46

  Quote from Kazuni;54308:

  
  I asked my Christian friend what she would do if she was pregnant and had no resources to care for the child, and she replied "I wouldn't ever be pregnant if I wasn't ready for it. God will keep me safe."
  Usually at this point in an argument I would get pissed and leave. The "God will _____" thing gets to me. God will not do everything for you, you have to work for yourself, too.

  
  
  If someone like that gets raped and pregnant, they'll just say something like "God is testing me".
  
  Pretty blind. But as they say, ignorance is bliss.
• Kazuni wrote on 2010-06-04 04:48

  Quote from Margatroid;54310:

  If someone like that gets raped and pregnant, they'll just say something like "God is testing me".
  
  Pretty blind. But as they say, ignorance is bliss.

  
  
  Everything is God... she doesn't bother to prove anything. I'm not saying anything against Christians in general, just my friend who is blissfully unaware that the world is not perfect. I don't believe anything is part of a "greater plan". Things happen because they happen, and sometimes life sucks.
• User495 wrote on 2010-06-04 17:56

  Quote from Kazuni;54308:

  Someone I know from school is Christian. Like, super-super-Christian.
  She thinks abortion is like killing a real person, like, one who has already lived and experienced. She wouldn't believe me when I told her fetuses mostly aren't conscious during the period when abortions are possible.
  
  I asked her if she would prefer for the baby to be born and then put up for adoption, but she didn't agree, saying "the mother and father should take care of the child themselves because they're the cause for it."
  
  This kinda thing pisses me off, because she thinks the world isn't perfect enough. When she sees someone punch another person she'd always turn to the person beside her and inform them that hitting people was wrong, even when it was obviously play-fighting.
  
  I also know someone who's adopted. She hates the fact that she doesn't know who her parents were, and she doesn't understand why she wasn't good enough for them. When she's upset, she often says that she wishes that her mother had had an abortion. Yes, it might seem like she's pinning her problems on her parents who weren't there, but having no idea who your real parents are, and being bounced around between foster homes isn't easy for anyone.
  
  I asked my Christian friend what she would do if she was pregnant and had no resources to care for the child, and she replied "I wouldn't ever be pregnant if I wasn't ready for it. God will keep me safe."
  Usually at this point in an argument I would get pissed and leave. The "God will _____" thing gets to me. God will not do everything for you, you have to work for yourself, too.
  
  See, this is when religion gets too tied in with science. Sure, it gives people hope or whatever, but when it's affecting their judgement and views of other people and the choices they make which are considered "unethical or sinful", it's really going too far.

  
  
  
  the friend I was having this debate with is pretty similar to that, I guess she might not be quite to that extreme but she ended up blocking me from this topic out of her beliefs about life (I should check if she really did block me though xD)
  
  and at first I've took on this topic with the idea of what's "best for the child" if abortion was inevitable, which is why I chose to say that I'm ok with it as long as the baby isn't really "alive" yet
  but everyone did bring up a good point about those, for a lack of better word, whores shouldn't be allowed abortions
  
  and also the rape thing
• Cucurbita wrote on 2010-06-07 19:59
  Related:
  
  msnbc.com Video Player
• User495 wrote on 2010-06-08 18:01
  o wow that just isn't right o_o if the mom dies wouldn't the baby die with her?
  
  I agree with when she said that "they're out of touch with reality"
• Tomates wrote on 2010-06-08 21:27

  Quote from Intex;53738:

  I think it's a woman's decision, it's HER body.
  The baby is insignificant compared to a woman who is capable of having a child.
  
  Especially in cases of rape or incest, but even teen pregnancies or "accidents."
  I've heard people say pregnancy is a risk/punishment to deter intercourse and enabling abortion would just encourage more teen sex.
  
  Forcing a teenager without the mental (and usually financial) capacity to take care of a child for the rest of her life is a harsh punishment.
  Sure the baby will live, but will it have a good life in the hands of someone who wanted to terminate it?

  
  
  I agree, I think its the woman's decision. And i've told people that too "what if the girl was raped?". I mean i don't try to convince my friends to be pro-choice or anything but moreso i'm more curious to what a Pro-Life person would say if the girl was raped.
  I don't try to argue with people who are Pro-Life. Whatever their opinion is then its theirs and vice-versa for me.
  
  Personally i'm pro-choice. I feel its the womans decision and especially towards things like rape. I don't act snotty and say "well your opinion is wrong". Its different for everyone. I really don't like how some people who do believe in Pro-Life get really defensive and say silly things. I've had people argue like your friend did with the bug thing.
• Juno wrote on 2010-06-08 21:50
  What it comes down is whether or not the fetus is not really alive/human because of it's current developmental state. The whole masturbation nonsense is amusing but doesn't hold water as sperm alone (or eggs alone) have no future in terms of developing. While a fetus may not very pretty or intelligent I don't think of them as any less human or alive than myself. For that reason my stance on abortion is pretty clear cut.
  
  In cases such as in the video Kitae posted where it's the mother's life or the child's life it's of course up to her. Honestly, I wouldn't wish that decision on anyone but it makes no sense to demand she 'takes one for the team' there.
  
  I also realize that without abortions in our current world we'd have some other problems. However, I'm confident that if we don't have that go-to option we'll come up with something better.
  
  As for laws and all that I don't feel there's much myself or people of my persuasion can do about it. I certainly don't agree with the common scientific conclusion, though to be fair there isn't really anything scientific about where the line between growth and life is drawn. You can measure when this or that function kicks in but deciding when the thing is alive comes down to semantics.
• Syrphid wrote on 2010-06-08 22:07

  Quote from Tomates;57794:

  I agree, I think its the woman's decision. And i've told people that too "what if the girl was raped?". I mean i don't try to convince my friends to be pro-choice or anything but moreso i'm more curious to what a Pro-Life person would say if the girl was raped.
  I don't try to argue with people who are Pro-Life. Whatever their opinion is then its theirs and vice-versa for me.
  
  Personally i'm pro-choice. I feel its the womans decision and especially towards things like rape. I don't act snotty and say "well your opinion is wrong". Its different for everyone. I really don't like how some people who do believe in Pro-Life get really defensive and say silly things. I've had people argue like your friend did with the bug thing.

  
  
  It doesn't matter if the girl was raped. If you believe in human rights and believe that a fetus counts as a human life then the fetus possesses human rights. Through whatever method the fetus was conceived, it is now a human life.
  
  Those who make an exception for rape are basically saying "if your father raped your mother you have no human rights". It seems their true reason for opposing abortion is to punish those who have poor judgment over their sexual behavior. "How dare you have sex, I must find a way to punish you."
• Spartaaaaa wrote on 2010-07-04 17:47
  There is absolutely no justification for abortion. Let us look at some common ones and I will show you why they make no sense.
  
  1) What if the girl was raped? First of all, the vast majority of unwanted pregnancies are due to dumb people having sex when they're not ready for a baby. In that case, they ought to take responsibility for the baby. But back to the whole "rape" issue... Why must an innocent human (the fetus) being die because someone else (the rapist) did something wrong? And yes, the fetus is a human being, it has all 46 chromosomes.
  
  2) What if the girl can't take care of the baby? Put it up for adoption or have a relative or friend take care of it. It may be an inconvenience, but that doesn't justify killing it.
  
  3) What if it has down syndrome? Using that logic, I could justify going around and killing everyone that has down syndrome and saying that I'm being "merciful".
  
  4) Doesn't the girl have the right to decide for herself? Using that logic, the girl would also have the "right" to kill any children of hers that are already born as well.
  
  5) What if the fetus has no consciousness? That logic would justify murdering people in their sleep because sleeping people also lack consciousness.
  
  These are some of the major arguments favoring abortion. If I missed any, then please tell me and I will address them.