y u globalignore

• Cucurbita wrote on 2012-01-03 06:14
  Yoorah is just saying eveerything I said against the ignore function when it first got implemented....
  
  Nice to see everyone taking notice when HE says the exact same thing.
  
  
  Hmph.
• Skye wrote on 2012-01-03 06:18

  Quote from Cucurbita;719604:

  Yoorah is just saying eveerything I said against the ignore function when it first got implemented....
  
  Nice to see everyone taking notice when HE says the exact same thing.
  
  
  Hmph.

  
  
  I think the two are a weeeee bit different.
• RebeccaBlack wrote on 2012-01-03 06:51

  Quote from Cucurbita;719604:

  Yoorah is just saying eveerything I said against the ignore function when it first got implemented....
  
  Nice to see everyone taking notice when HE says the exact same thing.
  
  
  Hmph.

  
  There's a pretty massive difference between one person willingly ignoring another and a moderator determining that it is mandatory that they be ignored by every single person.
• Kazuni wrote on 2012-01-03 07:30

  Quote from RebeccaBlack;719642:

  There's a pretty massive difference between one person willingly ignoring another and a moderator determining that it is mandatory that they be ignored by every single person.

  
  
  When that particular person refuses to respond to warnings and PMs from various moderators, and potshots are taken at him/her from many many other members, it becomes problematic.
  
  Their behavior or nature is not so much the problem, it's not banworthy, since he/she does not actively flame and take part in causing trouble.
  
  However, drama follows this person everywhere they go, so it seems, as the other members quite understandably are constantly provoked by said person's posts. Whether the poster is aware of this, well, as much as we've told them that their attitude is problematic, it doesn't seem to get through their head.
  
  With behavior that isn't strictly against the rules, but an attitude that causes us to reluctantly give other members warnings, what are we supposed to do?
  
  @Yoorah
  You can say incompetent over and over again, but seeing as you have only heard from said affected person whose opinions will be biased (and seems unable to listen to staff PMs over attitude), I doubt you're seeing the whole picture.
  We always try our utmost to keep members happy and posting, but when one person's satisfaction will affect a host of other members, the majority takes priority.
  
  At the risk of saying too much, I'll mention that when this particular member was previously banned, a temper tantrum followed. Although they promised to change their ways we saw no such change, and instead of provoking another spat, we resorted to measures, however desperate, that left many members happier, I'm sure, without seeing this person's posts.
• Jelly wrote on 2012-01-03 08:47
  The system works, why change it?
  
  Also, I never seem to get that issue. Maybe once every month or so but that doesn't bother me. I also have it set to max posts per page.
• TA wrote on 2012-01-03 10:58

  Quote from Yoorah;719368:

  Wrong. You just did it wrong. No matter how obnoxious someone may appear to be, in the vast majority of cases, things can be resolved diplomatically no matter how bad they may seem. The fact that you had to make excuses for how you do your job alone shows that you're not good at this, which in turn makes you an incompetent member of the staff.

  
  
  How I do my job? What, do you imagine that I add people to the Global Ignore? I was a Moderator until only 2 days ago. Do you really think I would have that kind of power?
  
  There are two members of staff, which I will laughingly mention "you respect" that do this:
  - Arsik
  - Osayidan
  
  No one else. No one else is even involved in the decision making process regarding the Global Ignore. So you can drop your snippy little attitude with me, mister.
  
  The rest of the staff try hard to resolve conflicts, playing tag-team and opting to pass the ball to other members of staff when it's clear a user does not respect us whatsoever (for instance, I would defer to someone like Phunkie to talk to you in my place... as you obviously have less than any semblance of respect for me), as continuing to talk to them would be pointless for that particular member of staff. If they're calling one member of staff a variety of names that under any normal circumstances would be banworthy, and then suddenly are happily respectful and pliable with another, then obviously it was in our best interests to tap out and let someone else deal with it.
  
  It happens from time to time, and it's not always the member's problem. Sometimes something a member of staff says strikes them the wrong way, and some people tend to get very upset and hold grudges a very long time. Though keep in mind, I'm not saying it's me who this always happens to, because it's not. In fact, I've been the "tag" in the tag team more than once, and situations were deescalated.
  
  Not every extreme situation results in global ignores and permabans. The vast majority of cases are dealt with. This is where we get into the entire problem at hand.
  
  I don't know whether you imagine that every user that is punished is somehow subjected to the Global Ignore or what, but the "vast majority of cases" are resolved. The ones that are put on the Global Ignore tend to be the "rare minority"; that is, the ones that absolutely have near-zero chance of ever changing, or extreme troublemakers.
  
  With that said, I won't say I agree with everyone that's been added to the list, but that wasn't my decision. I've voiced my opinions about it (in the Staff Section, where it belongs), but in the end I defer to our Admins and am obligated to respect their decision and authority on the matter. I'm not the leader of this site. Without some kind of clear chain of command, things would just crumble. The Staff doesn't always see eye to eye on matters, and sometimes someone has to make the hard decisions. That's what they're there for, and we have to respect their decisions when they're made.
  
  We don't have to agree with them, but we do have to respect them, and abide by them.
  
  
  

  Quote from Yoorah;719368:

  Way to overreact. lol
  1) "Poor Yoorah" only points out what he believes to be wrong from a technical and usability standpoint. Not to mention the moral principle plays a role as well.
  2) An entire community doesn't get "outraged, constantly flaming and trolling everywhere because of a single member". LOL
  3) If you don't like dealing with problematic users properly, and/or if you can't deal with problematic users properly, then you should just resign. This job isn't for you.

  
  
  So coming from someone telling members of staff that they're incompetent and should quit, you think that... I'm the one with an overreaction here... That's... yeah, okay.
  
  I, personally, don't mind dealing with problematic users and trying to resolve things diplomatically. But that's not my call.
  
  When things reach a point where an Admin determines there is no rectifying the situation regardless of how long we (the entire staff) talk to said person, then bad things happen to the person.
  
  

  Quote from Yoorah;719368:

  Whining about volunteering for free when you agreed to do the work in the first place is just kinda, well... yeah. Working hard is good and all, but in the end it's pointless if you don't do it right. It's also a rather poor excuse for basically deceiving people.

  
  
  I wasn't whining about doing the work. I was attempting to make you a bit apprehensive for so disrespectfully and openly attacking us so brazen and irresponsibly. There are better channels, and for one that preaches so much about us being incompetent and being able to resolve any matter diplomatically, you sure are a poor diplomat yourself.
  
  You've convinced practically no one of your argument (except maybe yourself and Claudia), and you resorted to attacking and insulting your target audience very early in.
  
  That's very diplomatic of you. Oh how I'd love to see how much better you could resolve our issues...
  
  Cause this is just certainly... just a great example of excellent diplomacy right here.
• Arsik wrote on 2012-01-03 16:44
  Okay, since it's been revealed that I'm one of the masterminds behind putting 2 of the 4 accounts on the global ignore list, I might as well straighten it out. Yes, I did say that we need to put them on the global ignore list. The first one that I recommended was a person that no one wanted here, no staff members, no regular members, no one, because he had to be one of the worst typers that anyone has ever seen. In fact, he is the user that brought up a possible policy involving members to have near perfect grammar every time they posted outside of Bean Rua.
  
  I know that I asked him several times, and one time telling him bluntly that something would need to be done if he continued to post the way that he does. I'm sure that several of the other staff members intervened as well about it, but in the end, his reasoning behind typing the way that he did was, and I'm going to type it in a way that won't make my brain explode trying to emulate it, "I know English grammar, I just don't care about it, so I'm going to continue typing like this, even though it annoys everyone else". So in the end, it was pretty obvious that we couldn't get him to change, but since his actions didn't warrant a ban, we put him on the global ignore list. On that list, he stayed for a good solid 8 months before making a new account. On that new account, he started to have better grammar, at least good enough to make the staff not think it was him. Then he started to go back to typing to how he was before. Another member joked about how bad his grammar was compared to the first account, and the guy said that he and the old account were the same person. He posted a few more times, like how he did the first time he was a member here, so we put him back on the global ignore list, where he's still active today.
  
  As for the second one, I absolutely know that we contacted him several times leading up to his placement on the global ignore list. Numerous times it was asking him kindly if he could stop for a bit so that others don't have a reason to attack him. He didn't listen and continued. In the last exchange of PMs I had with him, I bluntly told him "Your threads are the source of all the drama on this site as of late, so if you don't stop with the threads that are only about how "bad" your life is, I'm going to have to cut the source of the drama off from the rest of the site, and since all of the said drama is centered around you", and not even 5 minutes after replying to that PM, saying that he'll stop making those types of threads, he made another thread about how bad his life was, so I followed through on my warning to him. We could have just flat out permabanned him, since his threads, especially the one that came right after saying that he'll stop, was made, in his words "unintentionally", to trollbait the other members, who all have had it with him and his general disrespect that he has shown them throughout his time as a member here.
  
  And all of this was coming from him getting banned from this site before because of having a negative attitude towards this site's community and general disrespect. He made an appeal, or rather one of his friends did, about the ban, and the staff agreed that his permaban (which was one that was delivered over the admin who originally banned him for only a couple of weeks) was much longer than necessary, though we mustn't forget that after he was banned, he made a thread on the Nexon forums bashing the site because everyone got tired of him constantly making "Mabi's doomed" threads, and having all of them tell him that they are tired of seeing, not even reading, those threads everyday. He then came back from his ban (which was lifted a week earlier than the original ban was intended to lift), made an open apology letter to the community that he'll change his personality, and not even three weeks after that, he was already starting to be disrespectful of other members, albeit towards a certain group of members that belong to a certain guild on a certain server.
  
  So it's not like the staff just went ahead and go "trololol who shud we pik on nao", and slapped a random member on the global ignore list, just because we don't like them posting here. We tried to get them to change, and 1/3 of the people said that they would change their ways twice, but they refused to, either through stubbornness, or lacking of ability to understand how serious the staff is about how bad they are acting. So, if they didn't want to listen to the staff's advice, nor their warnings, then they deserved where they ended up. Yes, it all could have been avoided if other members were to put those said people on their own ignore lists (and I even demanded people to put the said two people on their ignore lists, because we don't want to see any more drama), but for some people, that would have never happened, and as far as I know, there's no way that a normal admin can force a person onto another person's ignore list (I don't even have the power to put people on the global list, only recommend the idea to Chise), so we had to do what we had to do.
  
  Is it fair to the people we put on it, no, not entirely, but they could have easily avoided their fate if they just listened to the staff's warning to stop, which they, again, refused to. Should we punish the people that attacked the people that ended up on the ignore list? Yes, but it's one of those situations that if we punished everyone that was involved with the drama, then we would have lost a very large chunk of our active population at the time of the incidents. It's pretty similar to Nixon granting amnesty to everyone that dodged the draft for the Vietnam War. If you arrested all the people that dodged the ban, then you'll have less people working and costing the government a lot of money since they now have to either overfill prisons and/or build new ones, and with less people working, that's less money they're getting from taxes. While yes, we don't make any money here, and we can put as many people on the banned users list without worrying about it being overfilled, we still would have damaged the community greatly by having to ban all of the people involved, even if the ban was only for three days, since a large portion of the community was involved.
• Adelynn wrote on 2012-01-03 17:22
  Whether you like it or not, some people are never going to listen no matter how nicely you try to get them to cooperate. Whether they're like this on purpose or not, there's just that certain kind of attitude/behavior that gets on nearly everyone's nerves, but the person stays just enough within the lines to avoid getting banned. The staff members are doing their job. It's not like putting someone on the global ignore is something they take lightly. I'm pretty sure they make multiple attempts at reasoning with them first, and that the person failed to see what they were saying, or chose to disregard it. That is the kind of person that gets put on the global ignore list.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2012-01-03 17:25
  So wait, whats the difference between getting banned and getting put on the global ignore list?
  
  Wouldn't the only difference be that I wouldn't know I was "banned" for a while?
• Claudia wrote on 2012-01-03 22:08

  Quote from Cucurbita;720212:

  So wait, whats the difference between getting banned and getting put on the global ignore list?
  
  Wouldn't the only difference be that I wouldn't know I was "banned" for a while?

  
  
  That was pretty much what I was saying.
  
  I do, however, greatly appreciate moderators coming in and explaining their actions and the full situation. Thanks, guys, really. It was helpful in understanding.
• RebeccaBlack wrote on 2012-01-03 22:40

  Quote from Arsik;720168:

  The first one that I recommended was a person that no one wanted here, no staff members, no regular members, no one, because he had to be one of the worst typers that anyone has ever seen. In fact, he is the user that brought up a possible policy involving members to have near perfect grammar every time they posted outside of Bean Rua.

  
  Does grammar really matter, at the end of the day? As long as people can tell what the message is, how it's delivered shouldn't be of much importance. If it really bothers people that much, they should probably find better things to be worried about. I know you don't like dealing with a bunch of regulars who are all saying the same thing to one person, but I believe it would be warranted in this case.
  

  Quote from Adelynn;720207:

  Whether they're like this on purpose or not, there's just that certain kind of attitude/behavior that gets on nearly everyone's nerves

  
  I suppose my point is that I don't believe that people should be banned unless they're intentionally causing problems. If people just get annoyed or don't like them... oh well, imo.
  

  [FONT=Comic Sans MS]He posted a few more times, like how he did the first time he was a member here, so we put him back on the global ignore list, where he's still active today.[/FONT]

  He's still around? ._. You'd think he would've noticed by now...
• TA wrote on 2012-01-03 23:03

  Quote from RebeccaBlack;720589:

  Does grammar really matter, at the end of the day? As long as people can tell what the message is, how it's delivered shouldn't be of much importance. If it really bothers people that much, they should probably find better things to be worried about. I know you don't like dealing with a bunch of regulars who are all saying the same thing to one person, but I believe it would be warranted in this case.

  
  
  It was much worse than you likely imagine.
  
  It was like that thing were those /b/tards intentionally misspell words, use the wrong words, and add random capitalization for no apparent reason. It comes off, not even as someone just genuinely with bad grammar, but someone that has to try (and I mean ****ing hard) to have such horrible grammar. Here's an example:
  
  

  I did their not Fricking Replying i Even Stated on the Orginal Post i was going to Add more and the reason why i double Posted
  
  I Go to Both Forums Theses Fourms for more non Troll Chat Nexon Forums for Selling / Helping and my Refraction was Reversed she Realized she Made a Mistake with it Being Bean Rua ! I ll repost edit the Poem on my Poem Page
  
  Theses were all i did last i Check thats not Glotaing I even Stated i was Going Revised / Edit my Old Post Back to end the Conservation Not once was i Stating i was Supeior

• Claudia wrote on 2012-01-03 23:12
  I was about to say, I don't know if you saw that user, but their posts were brutal. Spelling/grammar is also one of my massive nitpicks.
• Cucurbita wrote on 2012-01-04 00:01
  So if I'm right, global ignore is a ban without a ban.
  
  In which case "global ignored because it doesn't actually constitute a ban" is kinda nonsense. Because you banned them. They no longer have a voice, and in a forum thats all being banned is. I'm not saying what the moderators are doing is wrong, I'm just saying that the function of the global ignore seems to be vastly flawed.
  
  Oh whatever. If the new forum won't have it then its not worth discussing.
• Yoorah wrote on 2012-01-04 04:55

  Quote from Kazuni;719691:

  @Yoorah
  You can say incompetent over and over again, but seeing as you have only heard from said affected person whose opinions will be biased (and seems unable to listen to staff PMs over attitude), I doubt you're seeing the whole picture.
  We always try our utmost to keep members happy and posting, but when one person's satisfaction will affect a host of other members, the majority takes priority.

  
  Actually, I've never spoken to said person. I was only indirectly made aware of it by someone else. :3
  
  

  Quote from TA;719939:

  How I do my job? What, do you imagine that I add people to the Global Ignore? I was a Moderator until only 2 days ago. Do you really think I would have that kind of power?

  
  Nah, I was referring to your poor attitude overall. Like in your replies here and elsewhere.
  
  

  Quote from TA;719939:

  You've convinced practically no one of your argument (except maybe yourself and Claudia), and you resorted to attacking and insulting your target audience very early in.

  
  Orly? Read the thread again.
  There's also those who've given me positive feedback privately.
  And then there's those who may have been convinced, but never said anything.
  I also got my 5th rep bar from this! \o/
  

  [Image: http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/4036/captureihp.jpg]

  
  
  And why mention Claudia? You're acting as if that's a meaningless achievement.
  You have to remember.. she is a woman. Convincing one of anything at all can often be quite tough! You can even see this in the staff replies here. The guys are pretty chill. But the women... god help me. D8
  
  

  Quote from TA;719939:

  That's very diplomatic of you. Oh how I'd love to see how much better you could resolve our issues...
  
  Cause this is just certainly... just a great example of excellent diplomacy right here.

  
  I can typically deal with issues that have something to do with me quite well, thanks! And while I'll agree that my posts towards you are not exactly angelic, I feel that given your attitude, you don't deserve much better. And besides, your bar is set higher than mine, being a staff member and all. So even if we both acted like equal asses, you'd still look worse.
  
  @Arsik
  Thanks for the clarification. I can't criticize much there, given the rational argument. And you saved TA's arguments from being picked apart more (furniture? come on..). xd
  I do have a problem with one thing, though:
  

  Should we punish the people that attacked the people that ended up on the ignore list? Yes, but it's one of those situations that if we punished everyone that was involved with the drama, then we would have lost a very large chunk of our active population at the time of the incidents.

  
  That's just not right. If a large chunk of the community is acting poorly, then a large chunk of the community needs to be taught to behave better. Otherwise, they'll do the same the next time they find someone to pick on. Which brings me to my previous side point: The staff are not very beneficial if all they do is enforce rules and talk to people who break rules. You need role models to prevent things from getting so volatile in the first place. As far as I can see, there are not many such people on the staff, and out of those, not all are active in the right sections or at all.
  
  But either way, as Kitae said, the new forum will likely not have such a function, so all is well regardless.