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Krymez wrote on 2015-03-28 17:52
Quote from Zyrus;1269281:
I've spent 20k ap in this game. If I was starting over I would probably go elf for 1 reason and 1 reason only. Elf hide + Hydra master lol. So overpowered combo. Can solo anything.
That being said Giant with Vales shield would be the easiest character to start with.
im not necessarily looking for easiest, i want a character that scales well with end game. If giants are... thats what i will be because im not a fan of the child look of humans and elfs.
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Burningsky wrote on 2015-03-28 18:10
I'd do giant endgame for smash damage/easy tank.
If you're looking for straight dps, reforge an elf for magnum spam and try not to get hit.
Human is a pretty safe medium.
Overall, I'd say main a giant because you like the aesthetics and they have the best melee scaling. If you're not sure what your fighting style is yet, try them all on your first character and then build the one you want to main later
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Krymez wrote on 2015-03-28 18:19
Quote from Burningsky;1269286:
I'd do giant endgame for smash damage/easy tank.
If you're looking for straight dps, reforge an elf for magnum spam and try not to get hit.
Human is a pretty safe medium.
Overall, I'd say main a giant because you like the aesthetics and they have the best melee scaling. If you're not sure what your fighting style is yet, try them all on your first character and then build the one you want to main later
im really interested in the puppet talent, would a giant be viable for that?
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Rydian wrote on 2015-03-28 18:25
I agree that you don't see many giants because despite their strengths, people will usually start human to be safe or elf because of fantasy/MMO stereotypes, and once they're established enough to realize the differences they've already invested a lot in their current char.
Lances get lots of piercing which does endgame stuff great, and giants can use the Vales shield which is the only large shield for the best defensive bonuses too.
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Krymez wrote on 2015-03-28 18:31
I think i will make a human just to get the free Elf and Giant cards to make mule alts... then make a Giant to use as my main. Keeping all others for storage
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Oensong wrote on 2015-03-28 22:29
Not entirely sure, however, the DEX gain over Giants that humans have, also contributes to Armor Piercing. I know its 1 damage more each, but that ends up being a tiny bit more with all modifiers included. It might not be worth mentioning, because by end game you are talking an extra what? 100 ~ 150 damage?
Anyways, Giants can dish out some pretty good damage, but as I have seen before, its not by a whole lot more. The advantages a Giant has are not having as many limitations on how many types of Melee weapons they can wield, i.e. Lance + Shield, etc, movement speed, and a little more damage over Humans.
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Rydian wrote on 2015-03-29 00:34
Considering that lances can't defend and Lance Counter is crippled in usability, the ability to have a Large Shield on the other hand, simply holding it there, is a huge melee advantage for giants given the bonuses from Shield Mastery ansd the (still) invisible combat bonuses you get just for holding a shield (that they really should display somewhere).
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Oensong wrote on 2015-03-29 15:22
However after the Melee Update when it reaches NA, Melee gets better with Shield use. Giants are still only just above Humans in DPS. Giants can be more tanky sure, though humans are not too far behind on Melee DPS.
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Syliara wrote on 2015-03-29 21:09
Quote from Oensong;1269404:
However after the Melee Update when it reaches NA, Melee gets better with Shield use. Giants are still only just above Humans in DPS. Giants can be more tanky sure, though humans are not too far behind on Melee DPS.
FH will make humans better in melee than any other class for dps. it would be kinda pointless to use a shield as a human after fh revamp.
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Citrusjuice wrote on 2015-03-29 22:10
Quote from Nui;1269428:
FH will make humans better in melee than any other class for dps. it would be kinda pointless to use a shield as a human after fh revamp.
windblast, firebolt, smash,1 wc from dorren and your dps went from over 9000 to 0 for 240 seconds. Congrats.
Humans get pinged while dual wielding, gets hit and is almost dead. Giants? Life drain and smashes with lance. Cool.
There's actually really little downside to being a giant. Also remember they have 1 defensive skill over the other 2 races (stomp) which makes them even easier to use.
Lets just see how nexon decides to balance the races in the future lmao.
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Syliara wrote on 2015-03-30 00:09
Quote from Citrusjuice;1269434:
windblast, firebolt, smash,1 wc from dorren and your dps went from over 9000 to 0 for 240 seconds. Congrats.
Humans get pinged while dual wielding, gets hit and is almost dead. Giants? Life drain and smashes with lance. Cool.
There's actually really little downside to being a giant. Also remember they have 1 defensive skill over the other 2 races (stomp) which makes them even easier to use.
Lets just see how nexon decides to balance the races in the future lmao.
you do realize im talking about after the revamp right? FH will be akin to WotG with tons of damage and speed making all that dmg from alchemy completely irrelevant in comparison to the dmg from fh. The speed will be fast enough where mobs with ping wont really be able to react fast enough. You seem to not understand how ridiculous fh will be after its revamp.
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Citrusjuice wrote on 2015-03-30 00:20
Quote from Nui;1269444:
you do realize im talking about after the revamp right? FH will be akin to WotG with tons of damage and speed making all that dmg from alchemy completely irrelevant in comparison to the dmg from fh. The speed will be fast enough where mobs with ping wont really be able to react fast enough. You seem to not understand how ridiculous fh will be after its revamp.
you seem to be confused. I listed things that stops FH not damage skills that does greater dps. Windblast... yea.
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gundamweed wrote on 2015-03-30 00:27
Quote from Oensong;1269275:
As wiki as my backing(Not that its always correct...):
Humans end with: 979
Giants end with: 1,012
This is a 33 Strength difference which equals an exact 13 Max Damage difference.
Giants can get some interesting enchant set ups for Strength, though, there are better enchants for max damage that surpass Strength Enchants that are shared by both Giants and humans.
13 Max damage difference isn't too "overpowered." Movement speed is essentially the only "advantage" Giants have, outside the ability to single wield two handed weapons, until the Melee update comes into play.
Source: ....wiki.mabi.....com/view/Stats_and_Skills#Strength
(Not sure the rules on posting links, but I thought I would do a broken link.)
On the surface, it would appear that giants aren't that ahead of humans by much, but when you think about the practical differences, the gap in power increases by significant amounts
Take for example the difference in smashing power. all things constant, giants will always deal 20% more on their smash than anyone else. As my dear vice president would say, this is a huge fucking deal. A human with a two handed weapon and a thames still can't match a giant with just a two handed weapon. With fighter, a human can't wear heavy armor if they want to do the most they can, while a giant doesn't even have such concerns.
Something that I take for granted as a giant is the ability to run up to a target and smash it after knocking it back with regular attacks, while the enemy is still stunned. I never really noticed it until I was messing around on my human. Humans don't have that luxury, at least, not if their connection is like most people who don't live in the west coast. Also, that 3 second cooldown giants have on windmill makes a noticable difference compared to a human's 3.5 sec CD. In any given time, giants can windmill 17% more times than a human! More DPS, that's for sure, and safer spamming. Giant lancers have an easier time repositioning if they're too close, because of their lower min distance and faster movement speed.
Of course, the 13 max damage difference isn't a whole lot on it's own, but it's what accompanies that 13 max that makes all the difference. Being a giant is very well worth the cost of archery.
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Syliara wrote on 2015-03-30 01:37
Quote from Citrusjuice;1269445:
you seem to be confused. I listed things that stops FH not damage skills that does greater dps. Windblast... yea.
You would have to be dumb to be letting those things hit u while in fh. if u see a mob loading those skills u focus it and kill it or cancel the attack not just stand there and let it hit u.
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Oensong wrote on 2015-03-30 01:41
gundamweed
Hey, thanks for the good reply!
I see where you are coming from. No doubt that Giants pull more than humans. As Nui was saying however, the new revamp will allow Humans to pull more weight. Just based on FH alone. The cooldown however is the only drawback, and this is where I feel it starts to somewhat balance out.
Stomp being a factor, as citrus was discussing, All Melee users get "Rage Impact" which allows all nearby enemies to be stunned. The revamps done to Assault Slash and Charge, will also help with Mob Control. As little as it will be. This applies for all races.
FH will also not be taken out of its state of being in FH when knocked down. This is also significant. The speed increase as Nui was saying is also, very significant. This is great for Mob and Single target.
But yes, gundamweed, as for right now, Giants pull ahead. But don't forget that things like wavesweepers and Fleet Feet exist. And this can help with all the movement stuff you were talking about before with humans. A laggy Giant may still receive the same delays on Windmill as a Human that is lagless. So these can be very subjective things we are discussing. But assuming everyone had the same ping time, Giants are better right now on Melee AOE, DPS, and Movement.