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Maruja wrote on 2011-02-21 19:04
This is not the first time i have seen this discussion about physical crit on Evie. I took the advice of several guides and decided not to rank my physical crit and i am very happy with the way my toon plays. For one thing, It would be a annoying for me to send mobs flying on the up swing when dealing with large groups and it is important to be able to land your snap attacks for mob control, especially when you're soloing and trying to take out large groups spread around a room. If you send your target flying and fail to land the smash you will not be able to activate you're thread or mark of death etc... Also more importantly, there is no reason to add more damage at this point, especially at the sacrifice of my toon's playability due to the fact that i can take out and mobs/group of mobs on the new boat in a single combo with or without the extra crit. I suggest you forget about the crit for now at least, maybe it will be of some benefit later when you an 1 shot everything in the game xD
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SozenCratosFocker wrote on 2011-02-21 19:39
:what:
Quote from GregHouse;344209:
What is there to miss is the magical part of Invisible Loom smash, wich hits harder than BT snap.
According to
These damage multiplier charts(Which seem to match what I see ingame for scythes), if you have everything unranked, and your physical and magical attack stats are the same, then the damage done by the thread snap would be
the same as the
total damage of
both hits of Loom, not less than one hit of it. Physical attack stat is generally about 2k lower than magical for Evies, so the thread snap would actually do more than the entire loom.
If you have smash mastery maxed (6) and BT maxed (A), BT still does almost 9% more damage than the magical part of loom.
Am I missing something?
:pick:
Do you have Smash Mastery Maxed and BT unranked?
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GregHouse wrote on 2011-02-21 19:45
Quote from Maruja;344538:
This is not the first time i have seen this discussion about physical crit on Evie. I took the advice of several guides and decided not to rank my physical crit and i am very happy with the way my toon plays. For one thing, It would be a annoying for me to send mobs flying on the up swing when dealing with large groups and it is important to be able to land your snap attacks for mob control, especially when you're soloing and trying to take out large groups spread around a room.
I have read those guides too, but those were out back when we didnt have boat 5, not everyone plays Vindictus KR. Now that we can experience it by ourselves i think its important to re think the matter.
Quote from Maruja;344538:
If you send your target flying and fail to land the smash you will not be able to activate you're thread or mark of death etc... Also more importantly, there is no reason to add more damage at this point, especially at the sacrifice of my toon's playability due to the fact that i can take out and mobs/group of mobs on the new boat in a single combo with or without the extra crit. I suggest you forget about the crit for now at least, maybe it will be of some benefit later when you an 1 shot everything in the game xD
If your smash sends it away, you can still use the EX smashes. My thought was to wait and see, so far im glad i didnt rank it. I however think that on boat 8 (and forward) Critical Hit will be useful since monsters there dont flinch.
(avoiding double post) Hi Sozen. Yeah, i think i made a mistake in there. BT percentil is 0.24, Magical part of Invisible Loom is 0.20, so Magical part its not higher in damage than BT. My bad.
However, the part we miss is the 83,3% of the Snap... so we could lose quite a bit of damage right? Tell me what you think. (And i had -pre patch- everything maxed except Crit and Will.)
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ilmura wrote on 2011-02-22 04:55
Quote from GregHouse;344209:
You cant miss Bloody Thread unless you dont hit the mob at all. What is there to miss is the magical part of Invisible Loom smash, wich hits harder than BT snap.
I don't really know what to say =/. I just recently ranked/maxed crit and I didn't notice doing less damage during the Invisible Loom's smash or my Snap damage. When I kill a boat 5 mob with Invis Loom smash, I usually overkill around 1300~1500 damage. When I kill them with a Snap (without actually hitting them beforehand) I usually overkill around 1500~2000. Regardless of how much damage I overkill them by, I feel I kill the mobs at the same speed (if not faster) than other lvl 52 sycthes. Also, I still don't notice the knockback that people keep talking about, I feel like it's over-exaggerated. If anything they move a bit, but it's not like they fly across the screen or anything.
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GregHouse wrote on 2011-02-22 05:07
Quote from ilmura;345568:
I don't really know what to say =/. I just recently ranked/maxed crit and I didn't notice doing less damage during the Invisible Loom's smash or my Snap damage. When I kill a boat 5 mob with Invis Loom smash, I usually overkill around 1300~1500 damage. When I kill them with a Snap (without actually hitting them beforehand) I usually overkill around 1500~2000. Regardless of how much damage I overkill them by, I feel I kill the mobs at the same speed (if not faster) than other lvl 52 sycthes. Also, I still don't notice the knockback that people keep talking about, I feel like it's over-exaggerated. If anything they move a bit, but it's not like they fly across the screen or anything.
Hello ilmura, i made a mistake on Invisible Loom Magical part damage, check my post above. Its not the distance they are sent away, its the fact that the magical aprt of the smash misses. I would like to use Hero Mode as an standar. Buffed monsters now dont die in 2 Full Invisible Loom + BT, maybe if you try it the knock back there will be more obvious. Its not the end of the world, its not a deal breaker, its just the possibility of losing 83,3% of 1 BT, wich logicly would result in slower clearence time. Thats it, dont take it as somethig horrible, just as an step further to achieve maximum efficency with our damage.
Also, judge using over kill isnt accurate.
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ilmura wrote on 2011-02-22 17:48
Quote from GregHouse;345584:
Hello ilmura, i made a mistake on Invisible Loom Magical part damage, check my post above. Its not the distance they are sent away, its the fact that the magical aprt of the smash misses. I would like to use Hero Mode as an standar. Buffed monsters now dont die in 2 Full Invisible Loom + BT, maybe if you try it the knock back there will be more obvious. Its not the end of the world, its not a deal breaker, its just the possibility of losing 83,3% of 1 BT, wich logicly would result in slower clearence time. Thats it, dont take it as somethig horrible, just as an step further to achieve maximum efficency with our damage.
Also, judge using over kill isnt accurate.
Ahh, my apologies, I didn't read it =3
Sorry, I really don't know how to judge how good/bad critical is, that's why I used it. As for Hero mode, I am able to LLLLR + BT, L then they die for boats 1~3. In boat 4 a kill requires 1 LLLLR + BT + LLLLR. Boat 5 is more, but I'm not too sure.
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futaki wrote on 2011-02-25 08:12
Guess I'm screwed lol!
Rank 6 Critical woot woot
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Amada wrote on 2011-02-25 16:19
I don't really see an issue... Trash mobs are exactly that, trash. Ranking Physical Critical Hit isn't a good first move for Evie's mostly due to the shear cost of the skill and lack of benefits. However, I wouldn't write off the skill completely especially since bosses stay still regardless of whether or not you crit. (Stumbles being an exception, but those mess everyone up.)
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TA wrote on 2011-02-25 18:08
Quote from Amada;350660:
I don't really see an issue... Trash mobs are exactly that, trash. Ranking Physical Critical Hit isn't a good first move for Evie's mostly due to the shear cost of the skill and lack of benefits. However, I wouldn't write off the skill completely especially since bosses stay still regardless of whether or not you crit. (Stumbles being an exception, but those mess everyone up.)
I dare say it's not a good skill
at all for Evie.
Trash mobs aren't so much trash as the boats get higher... it's silly to intentionally do something that could give you a disadvantage with them.
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xJac wrote on 2011-02-25 18:28
You don't need higher boats already, right now hero mode elite mob is already good enough.
Sure, Critical Hit might knocked those mob away (Keep in mind the MIGHT), but it's likely that the monster that can't be finished with BT, still won't be able to finished by getting your Magical portion of the damage on the mob.
Trash mob is named trash mob for a reason, plus no many people always solo, which completely makes knocking monster back irrelevant to killing speed.
Afkalmighty said it CAN be a hinderance, meaning it can, but not it will always do.
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GregHouse wrote on 2011-02-25 20:44
Im very certain about the "might" part of it, since after all critical hit its a %. Now, it could be an inconvinience on boat 5, maybe 6 and 7, but it seems it is good thing for boats 8 and on. "Trash mobs" there doesnt flinch or get KB, so crit would only mean more dmg.
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Nichibon wrote on 2011-02-25 21:49
Quote from Amada;350660:
I don't really see an issue... Trash mobs are exactly that, trash. Ranking Physical Critical Hit isn't a good first move for Evie's mostly due to the shear cost of the skill and lack of benefits. However, I wouldn't write off the skill completely especially since bosses stay still regardless of whether or not you crit. (Stumbles being an exception, but those mess everyone up.)
^^This.
Level your magic damage stuff first, smash finishers, Reaper, and maybe golem. Then do whatever you want. By the time you are able to level crit (i.e. all teh important stuff is maxed), you're just blowing AP. Either way...crit should be very low on teh list. Combat Mastery adn STR would be better skills to put into if you have teh spare AP.
The "downsides" for crit aren't bad enough to where you'd never want to rank it.
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Mama wrote on 2011-02-25 23:10
I always duo at least, so I am depending on my partner having my back if anything goes wrong, and having a mob go wheeee away from me is of least concern, and the adverse effect on my gameplay is trivial.
I think the fear with critical hit is the feeling that it's out of your control, and in the event that it happens somehow the boss will hit you and you will die, or the mob will somehow bite you in the ass afterwards if you're being careless. Honestly, the boss finishes the job for me most of the time :p
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princesss wrote on 2011-02-26 05:10
so tell me guys
if yu enjoy wasting time in hero mode and gauntlet esp the stoneskinned monsters, yu wud wanna rank crit to r6 and knock them away?
id rather not rank up crit and do LLLLR + bt .
sorry to say for all those who ranked critical to r6 GG.
if yu wanna waste time and chase the monster yu knocked all across the map then go ahead. LOL
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futaki wrote on 2011-02-26 07:57
Quote from princesss;351381:
so tell me guys
if yu enjoy wasting time in hero mode and gauntlet esp the stoneskinned monsters, yu wud wanna rank crit to r6 and knock them away?
id rather not rank up crit and do LLLLR + bt .
sorry to say for all those who ranked critical to r6 GG.
if yu wanna waste time and chase the monster yu knocked all across the map then go ahead. LOL
Ok I guess 10 seconds off a run because you are chasing a mob is a big deal. OK LOL