General Melee Discussion - WM is not being nerfed in G14

• Syrion wrote on 2011-04-08 18:53

  Quote from Alexane;401630:

  Golem wm i can understand but honestly, 2 reasons they wont nerf it,
  1. they have a quest MADE for pure wm and using hp pots to get through it would cost an arm and a leg, It would give you such bad potion poison to avoid the 'nerfed' damage rate
  
  2. it's pretty much melee's ONLY aoe attack. yes other classes have aoe but for 100% melee it's the ONLY thing you can rely on when you are getting multi aggroed by 10+ monsters at a time (sulfer spider elite anyone?)

  
  
  1. would be interesting to make people run their method wearing -HP gear
  
  2. yea, even for mages/archers, wm is your backup when your mobbed to hell. tbh i wouldnt be against something like this if melee got another decent AOE that didnt force me to equip a lance.
  
  @Koishi: I dont think melee is that far underpowered, its just the most skill intensive to be effective at endgame.
• Zack wrote on 2011-04-08 19:02
  I always spammed pots when I wm'd anyways. It wouldn't bother me :p
• Alexane wrote on 2011-04-08 19:04

  Quote from Zack;401675:

  I always spammed pots when I wm'd anyways. It wouldn't bother me :p

  
  
  That works for some people but those of us with cypress items to avoid stamina potion use and a few emergency hp pots for when we know we're getting hit can usually run things and aggro control without getting poked =3
• Koishi wrote on 2011-04-08 19:08
  Not everyone can pet swipe. And 400 max untrans? That's a lot for total level 1.3k; do you have EVERY major STR skill maxed?
  
  See, asking people to pet play in the middle of a battle, especially if they have lag, is not realistic, and never has been. Just because a few pro players can do it on videos doesn't mean it should be a requirement to be effective. And again, lag is an issue. Oftentimes, summoning my deer lags me tremendously. Or my pet is slow in swiping. Or simply, I'm not fast enough with my hotkeys.
  
  I believe that skill hurdles (especially in a game that is so heavily affected by lag) is itself a gimp. If the AI was slowed to KR/CN/JP levels, or at the least, the lag in North America servers was fixed, then your argument makes sense. However, almost all of the difficulty in melee derives from the omnipresent lag and the hypercharged monster AI. And then, the melee player has to play mistake free to even MATCH other skillsets!
  
  And to top it off, the melee player doesn't have other viable options BUT this style, unless he wants to tank in a game in which tanking is virtually meaningless, or do nothing but chain combos on single monsters while mages mow down entire mobs.
• Alexane wrote on 2011-04-08 19:13

  Quote from Koishi;401681:

  Not everyone can pet swipe. And 400 max untrans? That's a lot for total level 1.3k; do you have EVERY major STR skill maxed?
  
  See, asking people to pet play in the middle of a battle, especially if they have lag, is not realistic, and never has been. Just because a few pro players can do it on videos doesn't mean it should be a requirement to be effective.

  
  
  At age 10 level....70 80 90 or 100 is what i usually float around, with my lizard spike falcatas, maxed raven fleet boots delu vine torks cap, 2 earthquake stout accessorys, extra glassfragment newbwear and wnwpc im around 400 max and 101% crit, my carpentry is around rank 7 or 6, not sure been lazy and not at home atm to check, rank 4 final hit, my str is over 300 without my 35 str accessory's I started 100% melee based and have been almost exclusively melee other then r1 range r5 ar r1 prod mastery refine, ect starting my range combat style off so i don't get bored of being 100% melee (dex floats around 200-250 depending on how much i level.
  
  
  *edit* pro players?......I'm far from pro and i know how to pet swipe...have the pet summons hotkeyed have sit hotkeyed and have de summon hot keyed...it's not as hard as it looks/sounds.
  
  *edit* my total is like 1385 so lets just say I'm 1.4k for arguments sake
  Also every double rainbow i've never gotten less then 1-70 few times i went to 80 (got to level 80 on one spend the next 5 days hitting level 100 for my journal points only ever hit level 100 2 times)
• Piko wrote on 2011-04-08 19:17
  Guess this makes Their Method less fun.
• starpaw7 wrote on 2011-04-08 19:24
  If this was true, Windmill training would be a lot harder :XD:
  
  

  Quote from Pikablu;401689:

  Guess this makes Their Method less fun.

  
  
  Guess you didn't read the thread :what:
• Koishi wrote on 2011-04-08 19:25

  Quote from Alexane;401685:

  At age 10 level....70 80 90 or 100 is what i usually float around, with my lizard spike falcatas, maxed raven fleet boots delu vine torks cap, 2 earthquake stout accessorys, extra glassfragment newbwear and wnwpc im around 400 max and 101% crit, my carpentry is around rank 7 or 6, not sure been lazy and not at home atm to check, rank 4 final hit, my str is over 300 without my 35 str accessory's I started 100% melee based and have been almost exclusively melee other then r1 range r5 ar r1 prod mastery refine, ect starting my range combat style off so i don't get bored of being 100% melee (dex floats around 200-250 depending on how much i level.

  
  
  Yeah, your entire set is about 12-15 million gold. EQ Stout is 2m each, and really only available to people with service. Raven Fleet is maybe 1m minimum. Dual Spike Falcatas was probably 6m for both during the event, probably more now. WNWPC is 1.5m assuming full dura. Delu Vine tork's cap is probably 500k on its own.Extraordinary ES is 200-300k.
  
  

  *edit* pro players?......I'm far from pro and i know how to pet swipe...have the pet summons hotkeyed have sit hotkeyed and have de summon hot keyed...it's not as hard as it looks/sounds.

  
  
  I know how to do it too? It's just hard as hell. I used to be pure melee, but I'm hybriding to magic. Maybe too early? Dunno. But believe me, I've tried the pet swipe thing. It is really hard, because you're multi-tasking on a second to second basis. It depends on personal hand-eye coordination and your lagginess (and I've done every lag fix in the book), as well as your hotkey setup.
  
  Honestly, I hate games that reward you for being able to cycle hotkeys quickly as opposed to actual tactics and preparation. That's why something like Zyrus's build appeals more to me right now, you go in with an overall strategy which can deal with a variety of missions, and get this, you can actually make a mistake or two in execution and not die like a dog. Melee is a fun playstyle, and I like being up close and personal in MMOs. But you know what else I like? Not dying.
• Alexane wrote on 2011-04-08 19:30

  Quote from Koishi;401696:

  Yeah, your entire set is about 12-15 million gold. EQ Stout is 2m each,
  (3m each on the alex server)
  
  and really only available to people with service.
  what? earthquakes are 1m buy one and run rundal basic hardmode
  
  Raven Fleet is maybe 1m minimum.
  maxed raven is like 2m since lack of botters fleet is around 500k i believe my raven is 1 off of max my fleet is maxed
  
  
  Dual Spike Falcatas was probably 6m for both during the event, probably more now.
  i got both for 3m
  
  
  WNWPC is 1.5m assuming full dura.
  10/11 bought it that way has been 10 max dura for like 4 months
  
  Delu Vine tork's cap is probably 500k on its own.
  That's about right, might be 1-200k more not sure
  
  Extraordinary ES is 200-300k.
  spent 500k on that one, lol
  

  
  
  My gear is still far from end game, i've saved all my money since i started running their method...300 total ish and saved up from tm adv, my first pair of 222 broads which i still have have made me all my armor all my money and pretty much everything i own today (few items like dragon shield, kaon muffler and raccoon cub were a gift) And untill like 1k total i was using giant quartz accessory's instead of stout earthquake for 7 max each, that's such an easy 7 max since you can burn them after.
  
  Everything i bought, i bought by saving up from tm and buying it when i can, it helps to be a smart shopper and wait a bit for things to drop, like how i got my falcatas for 1.2 and 1.8m a few times i got lucky from the nexons free gacha or events but I've lent out major amounts of money to people that are still trying to pay me back for so it evens out.
• Roy Mustang wrote on 2011-04-08 19:31
  This won't affect my melee except when I run Their Method.
  
  I don't spam wm to the point of deadly unless it's zombies because I refuse to risk being in deadly for mobs that have a chance of hitting me.
  
  I already spam pot if I start wming too much :D
• Syrion wrote on 2011-04-08 19:34

  Quote from Koishi;401696:

  Yeah, your entire set is about 12-15 million gold. EQ Stout is 2m each, and really only available to people with service. Raven Fleet is maybe 1m minimum. Dual Spike Falcatas was probably 6m for both during the event, probably more now. WNWPC is 1.5m assuming full dura. Delu Vine tork's cap is probably 500k on its own.Extraordinary ES is 200-300k.
  
  
  
  I know how to do it too? It's just hard as hell. I'm pure melee, but I'm hybriding to magic. Maybe too early? Dunno. But believe me, I've tried the pet swipe thing. It is really hard, because you're multi-tasking on a second to second basis. It depends on personal hand-eye coordination and your lagginess (and I've done every lag fix in the book).

  
  
  if you cut around 30 max damage from that set you could do it for a 1/10th the price, and still get a reasonable amount of damage
  
  with stout wild boars and broadswords over falcatas
  
  ive had reasonable success with pet swiping to manage aggro and can juggle around 4-5 aggro without much problems, at around 200ms ping, at 300+ it gets hard, but im all the way up in Canada so anywhere in the US should be fine with a decent ISP.
  
  it really improved my pet play alot to switch up my style and use it to defend my wming rather that ambiguously swiping anything on my ass.
  
  it also helps to preswipe monsters that havent aggroed you and desummon the pet to preserve them in a passive state
  
  tho what screws me over the most is hesitation to desummon a dead pet (cuz i hate it when i desummon it, forget to res it later, then summon it again only to go like FFFFFFF)
• Kayate wrote on 2011-04-08 19:38
  cue the wm QQ threads
• Koishi wrote on 2011-04-08 19:40

  Quote from Syrion;401709:

  i
  
  ive had reasonable success with pet swiping to manage aggro and can juggle around 4-5 aggro without much problems, at around 200ms ping, at 300+ it gets hard, but im all the way up in Canada so anywhere in the US should be fine with a decent ISP.
  )

  
  
  I average close to 300, and often go over it in dungeons.
• Malogg wrote on 2011-04-08 19:40
  Regardless of what they do with wm, melee needs more skills.
• Roy Mustang wrote on 2011-04-08 19:43

  Quote from DarkLord7;401719:

  Regardless of what they do with wm, melee needs more skills.

  
  
  One could say the same for ranged. Ranged has a far less amount of skills compared to Melee.
  
  Alchemy and Magic by far lead the pack in amount of skills.
  
  Magic having the most skills by far.