Your opinions on the class system

• Hiccup wrote on 2010-07-27 06:45
  Skill lock, armor/clothes lock.
• User495 wrote on 2010-07-27 07:16

  Quote from Blassreiter;105682:

  I believe this is to promote party play. I can't help but be reminded of Dungeons and Dragon games/Final Fantasy. If you are a Knight, find a Mage and Archer to come along for long ranged attacks to flying-enemies.
  
  Nonetheless it's still being tested, so calm down.

  
  
  Agree people are overeaggerating something that 1 is still being tested 2 probably don't even have all the facts on.
  
  

  Quote from bradstrt;106342:

  Skill lock, armor/clothes lock.

  
  
  because we're not already restricted by those things (age\race requirements)
  
  And I welcome this change
• Hiccup wrote on 2010-07-27 07:21
  HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAILSTORM!!! D:
• pkMaster wrote on 2010-07-27 07:46
  @JustNoOne I can see where you're coming from, but I don't think it's that big of a deal (yet). Allowing newer players to catch up to more experienced players through the class system allows the game to be more accessable to people who'd otherwise be detered by the stronger players and vast variety of skills to train. That also means that newer players will become useful a lot sooner, and players who have been focusing on one set of skills can gain an extra buff.
  
  My only concern at this point is the balancing of these new classes. If the adventurer is in deed stronger than all the other classes, then most people with near end game characters will probably stick to being adventurers and most new players would probably choose a different class until they fell ready to become an adventurer. Or if the classes are equally balanced, then some people will choose to migrate to the different classes while others remain adventurers since the advantages/disadventages of choosing each class will balance out and keep the playing field level (which means even the merchants, as useless as it may seem now will have it's uses).
  
  The one scenario which a lot of ppl are worried about is the one where the new classes completely overpower the adventurer class. At that point, the only ppl who'll stick to being an adventurer are the one's who don't want to lose out on the skills they've spent a lot of time getting. Of course, since most people here have spent a decent amount of time creating a strong hybrid character, this is a pretty big issue for them (myself included) because then the only way to get stronger would be to forfeit a large portion of the skills we spent the last year or so building up. This is what people are fighting against because they don't want their character's to loss a large chunck of their skills just to switch classes. And you also have to remember, some of these skills take a LONG time and a lot of AP to train.
  
  I can't really say what my opinion on this new system is, cuz I'm still not sure how things will ultimately play out. If DevCat does this correctly, then I'd gladly welcome the new class system. However, if implementing this means I'll have to give up a decent amount of strength to make my character even stronger, then I (along with the majority of ppl here) are going to be very upset.
• BobYoMeowMeow wrote on 2010-07-27 09:35
  They should not lock skills
  They can just buff the skills the classes are focused on.
  
  Also they should not lock armor.
  
  For example
  for mages, instead of not letting them wear armor.
  Just give them stats when equipped with cloth
  like increased mp recovery, max mp, and int
  
  or knights who wear heavy armor
  max hp and def
  Light armor
  Str and stamina recovery
  
  Bards
  increased dex with light armor
  increased aim speed with cloth
  
  something like that,
  
  Btw brad, late reply
  

  Quote from bradstrt;104976:

  Good thing I don't like WM :D

  
  
  

  [Image: http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p101/KunaixIchigo/Windmill_in_my_Beard.png]
• Hiccup wrote on 2010-07-27 10:12
  *shudder*
• Yogurticecream wrote on 2010-07-27 10:31

  Quote from Kazuni;105729:

  Also, your bard/alchemist thing. Yes, alchemists do have barrier spikes. Imo, they're getting overpowered.

  
  Barrier spikes is useless against those medusa-looking statues in G11 Tara castle missions.
  And I doubt it is in NA yet at this moment of writing.
• Toujirou wrote on 2010-07-27 11:41
  Imo they should get rid of the merchant class, and just allow all the classes to use all the life skills. I don't know why they would need to restrict that from all the classes. Everyone without life skills are gonna want to make merchant alts, while many of us with already high rank life skills are forced to wait 1-3 weeks to use em, if we decide to change to a specialty.
  
  I havent seen much arguement over the life skills (i could just be blind), but tailoring is pretty much my main source of income. Which pretty much leaves me with the question of, are the classes without sufficient production skills forced to get their source of income from item hunting or gacha? or do they just expect everyone to have merchant alts.
  Also why let all the classes use synthesis and not tailoring/blacksmithing/potion making?
• JustNoOne wrote on 2010-07-27 12:50
  @pkMaster
  
  I do believe balancing the classes is very very tough and balancing them is one of the major problems that comes with the class system. The problem with the class system is that now you have change a ratio of time spent on a certain set of skill and the degree of the outcome that comes ranking that skill, just to use less text, I need to use some MS Paint =P
  
  

  [Image: http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c373/chip103220/Table1.jpg]

  
  
  Like what I feel and others that said they feel on the other thread expressing their opinion, this is how I picture Mabinogi if players were to dedicate themselves to these "classes" before hand and with the class system, I'm afraid of Mabinogi becoming this:
  
  

  [Image: http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c373/chip103220/Table2.jpg]

  
  
  If the system ends up becoming like this, this can likely influence people to switch to classes because they can achieve the same result with a shorter amount of time because they are focusing on a set of skills rather than everything, but if the class system can do something like this:
  
  

  [Image: http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c373/chip103220/Table3.jpg]

  
  
  than I would be fine with the addition of the class system in terms of balance. It's just maintaining the balance is very difficult since you have 6 classes which can do many things, and DevCats wants to try them balance them all in their own aspect. How would you draw the line of a Merchant being just as well off as an Alchemist at end game or an Wizard becoming just as strong as a Adventurer at end game... it's pretty difficult to balance classes, one example would be Team Fortress 2, where the Pyro is just basically useless right now. Like... if people want to become a pure (insert class here) that's fine, they should have the ability to do that, but to make it unbalanced is not right. It's just that I cannot fully comment on the balancing aspect of the class system, since there hasn't been any result from the test players yet and what they saw.
  
  To not allow players to use all skills seems wrong, for instance I don't think that Hailstorm should be limited to only Wizards since it's not really bound by the race, but by the class, and it's not if Adventurers do receive Hailstorm, the balance of the class system would be destroyed (which I don't see the balance being there at all anyways) and since DevCat can tweak properties of skills, why not give this skill to all classes, or to allow all classes to use every skill? To restrict players of skills is not right and I believe they should use the skills they earned. I don't see what's the problem with not letting people use the skills they earned since they deserved it and if they had the idea of becoming a pure (insert class here) than they have the option to refrain themselves from using that skill anyways... I mean you don't need DevCat to tell you that at all.
  
  Same with restricting clothing and skill in future content or present content... it would make Mabinogi more class oriented and by just having the class system, it strikes me that DevCat can anytime make things very class oriented in Mabi.
• User495 wrote on 2010-07-27 14:30
  Forgot to mention a classless system is definately not how mabinogi is unique
  
  Though I would have a problem if they negate stat increases from skills you gain fromanother class
  
  And what really is the difference between "race locked" and class locked?
• Zid wrote on 2010-07-27 16:31

  Quote from Sevian;106542:

  Forgot to mention a classless system is definately not how mabinogi is unique

  
  
  Subjective for most people. One could say it's the classless system, the other could say "Because it feels like anime".
  
  

  Quote from Sevian;106542:

  Though I would have a problem if they negate stat increases from skills you gain fromanother class

  
  
  Some test players have confirmed that you lose the passive stats from skills blocked out.
  
  

  Quote from Sevian;106542:

  And what really is the difference between "race locked" and class locked?

  
  
  The difference isn't clear in the beginning, but take an estimate of high-lvl/end-game stats of all 3 races. Now an estimate of the classes' stats at similar ends.
  
  Also, put all 3 races in a melee situation with those stats, then all the classes in a melee situation with those stats.
• Vejosa wrote on 2010-07-27 17:08
  I personally enjoy these classes very much! they give players (melee only, range only, magic only, and alchemists) the option to be what we want to be and separate ourselves from people (the know it all hybrids) that penalize us every day on how"noob"we are for not learning every skill in the game. (Even though we have taken the challange to use only one type of gamestyle...hmm)
  Now its our time to laugh, when(if) we get all these new skills that they don't have we can say "why are you still an adventurer noob!".
  
  ...ok i'm getting a little hateful I should stop XD...
  
  To those people that are saying "I dont like this class system, because I want to use hailstorm!"
  You don't see giants crying "I dont like the race system, because I want to use mirrage missle!"
  or elves saying
  "I dont like the race system, because I want to use stomp"
  
  Learn to accept new things, accept change. To me this is going to be a good feature in the end. Complaining about it now wont change anything. Wait until its fully complete on the test server and then complain.
• Tatsigi wrote on 2010-07-27 17:58

  Quote from Vejosa;106607:

  I personally enjoy these classes very much! they give players (melee only, range only, magic only, and alchemists) the option to be what we want to be and separate ourselves from people (the know it all hybrids) that penalize us every day on how"noob"we are for not learning every skill in the game. (Even though we have taken the challange to use only one type of gamestyle...hmm)
  Now its our time to laugh, when(if) we get all these new skills that they don't have we can say "why are you still an adventurer noob!".
  
  ...ok i'm getting a little hateful I should stop XD...
  
  To those people that are saying "I dont like this class system, because I want to use hailstorm!"
  You don't see giants crying "I dont like the race system, because I want to use mirrage missle!"
  or elves saying
  "I dont like the race system, because I want to use stomp"
  
  Learn to accept new things, accept change. To me this is going to be a good feature in the end. Complaining about it now wont change anything. Wait until its fully complete on the test server and then complain.

  
  
  ^ I'm starting to really like her. Every post i've read for her reflects my views entirely.
• Chockeh wrote on 2010-07-27 18:10
  I'd like it if it weren't for disabling skills.
• Yogurticecream wrote on 2010-07-27 18:26

  Quote from Chocklitshop;106682:

  I'd like it if it weren't for disabling skills.

  
  Disabling is not a permanent penalty.
  Moreover, the point of disabling is to allow classes to specialise in areas of specialities AND not be an overpowered jack of all trades.
  I wonder why there are so many people who fail to see that.
  
  I don't see how Mabinogi has changed for its freedom concept. It never offered freedom. That already begun when you have elves and giants thrown into the game.
  All it does is to offer you a choice for gameplay.
  Be glad that they didn't fix classes (like how they did for race). Everything is still flexible with classes.
  
  And not all skills are disabled. Some of them are just disabled for training, but still can be used.
  
  Anyway I'm a lot more concerned about the class balance and economy elements for this. As Vejosa said, it's still in the test stage. No point worrying so much about things that are not final. They will fix it as they always do, even if it might be late. (Better late than never.)