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Hiccup wrote on 2010-05-04 04:22
Quote from Shanghai;27853:
Ok, let me clear up my beliefs of why does God never help anyone in pain or suffering. Not because he can't be in every place at one time, but the time on Earth for us was devised by God to plan and pack our treasures to be on Heaven. Life is just the pathway you take before reaching the eternity you spend with God.
Think of it like an obstacle course. You mess up, you fail and that goes on your record. However, you get back up again and forgive God for that mistake, and he'll accept it. Eventually, this will keep occurring over and over until you reach the end of the road, which is death. Sometimes, actions are too critical to accept, and that harms your record. There is time in your course to store up treasures in Heaven, which are the people you converted to Christianity to be with you for the eternity about to come. You also have chances to show your faith to God, and that'll go on your record. The people that die faster than others will have less time to gather their treasures and faith, but God will judge you equally to the time others have spent on this Earth.
The end of your path is your death, and God plans it so. When you die, your soul is supposedly put somewhere for a time before you go up to Heaven. When you get to Heaven, God weighs your sin and your successes and your faith, and sends you to where you should be. People with with more faith and do more deeds will get rewarded with the treasure they stored in heaven. People with little faith will have to cope with the little amounts of treasure you stored. Then there is Hell, which I'm not too particularly sure about, but it's for the people who have constantly sinned and never asked God to forgive their sins.
So converting someone to Christianity gets you rewarded? So people are now possessions if they convert cause of you. So by using others and bending their free will choice of not believing in Christianity to believing in Christianity is right? God sounds amazing. And why should I forgive God? Forgive God for putting me in a horrible situation? Forgive God for not helping out? Forgive God for the corruption of Man/Woman/Child?
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Juno wrote on 2010-05-04 04:23
It hasn't been super hostile as of yet, but since no conclusion can be reached the thread will simply spin on to infinity and beyond until fighting does break out. In the meantime nothing is learned and little if anything is gained.
I suppose I don't do any good saying this here though.
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Hiccup wrote on 2010-05-04 04:25
Learning about people's beliefs and trying to understand them only leads to a closer relationship. Shouldn't members of Guru at least understand each other?
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Kazuni wrote on 2010-05-04 04:26
Reasons I hate religious arguments:
a) God. - All knowing, can do anything, no explanation required.
b) Heaven&Hell. - imo, biased. Very very biased. I could go on and on about this factor. I mean, what human is born (created by God, perhaps) and is deemed to hell? Eg. Different religions (you go to hell), non-believer in any religion (you go to hell), homosexuality (you go to hell), incest (I love this one, Adam&Eve and such. Anyways, you go to hell), murder [even for religious reasons like Crusades] (you go to hell if you don't repent.) Even if you're a perfect person in every other aspect but the supposed imperfection or "sin" that you believe in another religion.. You. Go. To. Hell.
c) Sins. - Again, biased. What are sins? Everything is blamed on the "choices the person makes". Refer to b. Another huge factor.
d) Something else I was thinking about, but forgot. *edit. Oh yeah, relying on God. If they get in a tricky situation, "God will help me out. Everything happens for a reason." Well, sometimes God isn't there for you. That's why people die, okay?
e) Hardcore christians or of other religions - man those guys are intense.
I could go and dissect the bible and pick it apart, but I'd really rather not. There are a bunch of other things that I can't remember atm :\
There are contradictions on every page, part of the reason why I no longer believe in any religion. I used to go to church when I was little, but was never baptized, nor did I ever truly believe. I was too young, anyways.
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Cucurbita wrote on 2010-05-04 04:28
I believe in youkai jesus.
[Image: http://kazasou.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/konachan-com-57125-dress-flowers-hijiri_byakuren-long_hair-purple_hair-touhou.jpg]
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Shanghai wrote on 2010-05-04 04:29
Quote from bradstrt;27861:
So converting someone to Christianity gets you rewarded? So people are now possessions if they convert cause of you. So by using others and bending their free will choice of not believing in Christianity to believing in Christianity is right? God sounds amazing. And why should I forgive God? Forgive God for putting me in a horrible situation? Forgive God for not helping out? Forgive God for the corruption of Man/Woman/Child?
The goal of converting others is not only for your own personal benefit of having them with you for an eternity with God, but to get more people to the Holy Kingdom of God and away from sin. You forgive God for the sins you have commited. He'll accept them and forgive you because he died for our sins, but that doesn't mean he necessarily makes them disappear out of thin air like nothing happened. The Corruption of Man/Woman/Child was caused by the serpent, or Satan/Sin.
@Kitaek: So you believe in me? XD But really, all she wanted was just to have the youkai and humans co-exist so there would be no strife or anything. The saving stuff was just part of her act until she changed in her sealment.
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Kazuni wrote on 2010-05-04 04:30
Quote from Shanghai;27870:
The goal of converting others is not only for your own personal benefit of having them with you for an eternity with God, but to get more people to the Holy Kingdom of God and away from sin. You forgive God for the sins you have commited. He'll accept them and forgive you because he died for our sins, but that doesn't mean he necessarily makes them disappear out of thin air like nothing happened. The Corruption of Man/Woman/Child was caused by the serpent, or Satan/Sin.
That's kind of what bothers me.
"God created everything."
"Wait, so why is there corruption?"
"Blame Satan."
For everything good, it's God. Everything bad that contradicts, it's because of Satan.
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Hiccup wrote on 2010-05-04 04:32
Quote from Shanghai;27870:
The goal of converting others is not only for your own personal benefit of having them with you for an eternity with God, but to get more people to the Holy Kingdom of God and away from sin. You forgive God for the sins you have commited. He'll accept them and forgive you because he died for our sins, but that doesn't mean he necessarily makes them disappear out of thin air like nothing happened. The Corruption of Man/Woman/Child was caused by the serpent, or Satan/Sin.
And what if they were perfectly happy, non sinners (despite everyone having sinned) and in a different religion? I don't see why I should forgive God for something I have done. Did God make me do it? Did God influence me to that choice? I mean really, it doesn't make any sense.
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Iyasenu wrote on 2010-05-04 04:33
Quote from kitaek27;27868:
I believe in youkai jesus.
[Image: http://kazasou.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/konachan-com-57125-dress-flowers-hijiri_byakuren-long_hair-purple_hair-touhou.jpg]
win
:D
Oh, the world of Dharma is filled with Light~
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Shanghai wrote on 2010-05-04 04:35
Quote from bradstrt;27874:
And what if they were perfectly happy, non sinners (despite everyone having sinned) and in a different religion? I don't see why I should forgive God for something I have done. Did God make me do it? Did God influence me to that choice? I mean really, it doesn't make any sense.
The path God gives you which are your decisions are strayed by sin and temptation to do other things, which causes you to not follow God's will. That's why you must forgive him and to get back on tract on his path. If they were perfectly happy, you would still want them to come with you to Heaven so you can spend your happy lives with them.
@Iyasenu: That's not correct. It's "O, the Dharma is filled with Light~" Dharma means vitreous path or something, so the world of a path doesn't make sense. Trust me, I know. I RPed as her. :thumb:
I really should be working on my homework right now.:oops:
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Hiccup wrote on 2010-05-04 04:37
Despite being happy and content full-filling what their God wants? This makes God sound greedy. I shouldn't have to force/influence others to see my beliefs if they don't originally believe in it them self. On his path? I shouldn't have to follow his path, where's my free will? I shouldn't be punished by going to hell or not having "treasures" in heaven for a life I chose to live.
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Cucurbita wrote on 2010-05-04 04:42
Quote from Kazuni;27873:
That's kind of what bothers me.
"God created everything."
"Wait, so why is there corruption?"
"Blame Satan."
For everything good, it's God. Everything bad that contradicts, it's because of Satan.
Thats just the "simple answer" told to maintain faith.
The christian God is not perfect and makes quite a number of mistakes.
I have no issues with religion until the "you are not saved" nonsense is argued. God must be real douche bag if you go to hell for not believing in him. Even if I WANTED to I couldn't believe without 100% solid evidence, and who can actually blame me? And why rule over fear? Why is it that the overall end reason to believe in God "to avoid going to hell" like a threat? What about the 80% of the global population who haven't even been given a CHANCE, never even HEARD of Christ?
I rather go to hell than worship a God who is that unfair.
If I had a God, its not your God.
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Hiccup wrote on 2010-05-04 04:47
1 hour we managed 73 replies (including this one) and it didn't get flame infested! That's something.
I agree, but then again I don't believe in Hell. I just think when I die. I'm done. My body will rot in the ground and people will move on and eventually forget about me.
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Haydrian wrote on 2010-05-04 04:49
I am not a religious man, and I do not call to a "God". But at the same time I will not deny a true God. If there is a power in this universe mankind is probably best not to know of it. However, the journey towards meaning and truth can be very rewarding for your soul and inner peace. One is best to believe that anything is possible but that it is also possible that there is nothing. All religion was created by man for man to help explain that which could not and/or can not be explained. While the search for meaning can be very rewarding, the search may very likely end in nothing mroe than further question come the end of your life. Only in religion can one have an answer to which they can believe. I believe in only that which I can believe with my own common sense and reasoning.
Leave me to my philosophy. I find it silly to go by a belief, I find it better to have a good idea.
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Cucurbita wrote on 2010-05-04 04:50
Quote from bradstrt;27889:
1 hour we managed 73 replies (including this one) and it didn't get flame infested! That's something.
I agree, but then again I don't believe in Hell. I just think when I die. I'm done. My body will rot in the ground and people will move on and eventually forget about me.
Conscious thought is handled by the electrical activities in your brain cells. After death is just the "end". A forever sleep without dreams.