Is there really an upcoming meele nerf..?

• Slayerj wrote on 2013-08-04 23:58
  Apparently I missed something said by Snowie.
  
  Human and elves have to make a sacrifice eventually, Giants don't.
  
  It's a small sacrifice (cept with elves that were never supposed to be able to wear heavy armor to freaking begin with) and doesn't apply to every little thing, like Azareel said. Also it's only for heavy armor.
  
  Giants have Melee, Fighter, Alch, Guns, and a meh of magic.
  Humans have EVERYTHING.
  Elves have almost EVERYTHING and still have their mounted rage not buy-able via reforges.
  
  
  Anyway, making giants even 'better' at melee while still buffing everyone else defense to insane amounts for the cost of some damage shouldn't be making everyone flip. So many people used to say how much they missed the old mabi for the 'challenge', now we get what 'seems' like a nerf but isn't and people lose their god damn minds over it. >.> It's still not even close to coming out. We still have to finish the rest of the saga then wait maybe 2-4 months if not more.
• Howhurl wrote on 2013-08-05 00:19

  Quote from Azareel;1131628:

  Magic, Alchemy, and Bard. None of them really get backhanded by a dex penalty. So, for some players, that "eventually" never really happens.
  
  Other than that, you're absolutely correct and I applaud you.
  
  
  
  
  
  Subtle hint is subtle.

  
  
  lol. i was thinking it was sarcasm but didn't catch it
• Adrianblade wrote on 2013-08-05 01:00

  Quote from ewire123;1131617:

  Who care if Giant are better?
  
  We all know fashinogi > stats, which explain why Giant are the 1%. Who would change their race to Giant if given an option? Not me.

  
  
  In a heartbeat...HEARTBEAT
  
  And I've seen some really amazing giants :llama_delicious:
• Avino wrote on 2013-08-05 01:15

  Quote from Slayerj;1131630:

  Elves have almost EVERYTHING and still have their mounted rage not buy-able via reforges.

  
  
  YET!!!!!
• gundamweed wrote on 2013-08-05 05:02

  Quote from Gensokyou;1131572:

  
  
  It doesn't matter if it gives you the equivalent of a current 70% protection. It's not increasing your damage, especially if you're getting smacked around.
  
  
  Mana shield hate for the sake of it, lel.
  
  
  
  >Run out of things to say
  >quickly let's resort to ad hominem
  
  
  
  This is basically my thoughts.

  
  
  first off, such a buff would be a pretty big deal. second, there's no hate for mana shield. I love it and I'm feeling sorry for the nerfs. Quit putting words in my mouth. Third, there's no ad hominem, there's no attack on you. Simply if you're too stubborn to see why such benefits are buffs and why humans effectively miss out on them, you're beyond convincing because that's just how you want to be.
• Aubog007 wrote on 2013-08-05 05:06
  Apparently this turned into a DPS fest.
  
  
  Alrighty then.
• Snowie Stormflower wrote on 2013-08-05 07:29

  Quote from Slayerj;1131630:

  Apparently I missed something said by Snowie.
  
  Human and elves have to make a sacrifice eventually, Giants don't.
  
  It's a small sacrifice (cept with elves that were never supposed to be able to wear heavy armor to freaking begin with) and doesn't apply to every little thing, like Azareel said. [UB]Also it's only for heavy armor.[/UB]
  

  
  
  You could still consider it a sacrifice if you decide to not wear heavy armor, because you'll be giving up on defense to maintain your damage output.
• wildk wrote on 2013-08-05 07:51

  Quote from Kaeporo;1131597:

  Lance+Guard Cylinder is not unlike the Merlin Suilen Knuckles or Singing, people. Realize this.

  
  
  I really don't know, I mean water cannon and flame burst are out of the subject because I simply can't imagine people dealing 30k damage would suddenly use a skill that does 2k over a course of maybe 5 seconds. Normal frozen blast is very fail prone; shock actually disrupts enemy motion which makes lance charge/wm harder, rain cast needs lot of time to prep and if people had that amount of time they might as well equip a proper cylinder.
  
  If you're going to say that it allows quicker access to wave then you might as well just equip dual cylinders in secondary slot. I'm sure it's much quicker to switch slots than to open inv -> click on normal cylinder -> click on lance -> put lance somewhere else versus "tab" key.
  
  Regardless, none of the above matter since golden time is only one in 5 minute thing. Would you rather wear a useless shield for 5 minute just to save 3 seconds to switch out lance for dual cylinder or would you actually wear a proper shield and spend 3 more seconds to equip dual cylinders?
  
  I'm not saying guard cylinder is useless; to me who mainly does alch I'm sure I'd love it and dual cylinder all day long but I just can't imagine you guys actually using it. If it turns out I'm wrong then hey, good for everyone no? But just saying
• Gensokyou wrote on 2013-08-05 07:53

  Quote from wildk;1131779:

  I really don't know, I mean water cannon and flame burst are out of the subject because I simply can't imagine people dealing 30k damage would suddenly use a skill that does 2k over a course of maybe 5 seconds. Normal frozen blast is very fail prone shock actually disrupts enemy motion which makes lance charge/wm harder, rain cast needs lot of time to prep and if people had that amount of time they might as well equip a proper cylinder.
  
  If you're going to say that it allows quicker access to wave then you might as well just equip dual cylinders in secondary slot. I'm sure it's much quicker to switch slots than to open inv -> click on normal cylinder -> click on lance -> put lance somewhere else versus "tab" key.
  
  Regardless, none of the above matter since golden time is only one in 5 minute thing. Would you rather wear a useless shield for 5 minute just to save 3 seconds to switch out lance for dual cylinder or would you actually wear a proper shield and spend 3 more seconds to equip dual cylinders?

  
  
  It shouldn't even take you 3 seconds if you're american :u
  
  Or Korean. But their APM is about the same as my Act 7 damage.
• Snowie Stormflower wrote on 2013-08-05 07:56

  Quote from wildk;1131779:

  I really don't know, I mean water cannon and flame burst are out of the subject because I simply can't imagine people dealing 30k damage would suddenly use a skill that does 2k over a course of maybe 5 seconds. Normal frozen blast is very fail prone; shock actually disrupts enemy motion which makes lance charge/wm harder, rain cast needs lot of time to prep and if people had that amount of time they might as well equip a proper cylinder.
  
  If you're going to say that it allows quicker access to wave then you might as well just equip dual cylinders in secondary slot. I'm sure it's much quicker to switch slots than to open inv -> click on normal cylinder -> click on lance -> put lance somewhere else versus "tab" key.
  
  Regardless, none of the above matter since golden time is only one in 5 minute thing. Would you rather wear a useless shield for 5 minute just to save 3 seconds to switch out lance for dual cylinder or would you actually wear a proper shield and spend 3 more seconds to equip dual cylinders?
  
  I'm not saying guard cylinder is useless; to me who mainly does alch I'm sure I'd love it and dual cylinder all day long but I just can't imagine you guys actually using it. If it turns out I'm wrong then hey, good for everyone no? But just saying

  
  
  Equipping Dual Cylinders in the 2nd Equipment slots means sacrificing potential for another skill set.
  
  And now I'm thinking of Guard Cylinder + Lance in one, with Shylien Magic Knuckles in the other.
  Now Giants got pretty much everything covered (except Puppetry).
  Dat versatility.
• wildk wrote on 2013-08-05 08:10

  Quote from Snowie Stormflower;1131782:

  Equipping Dual Cylinders in the 2nd Equipment slots means sacrificing potential for another skill set.
  
  And now I'm thinking of Guard Cylinder + Lance in one, with Shylien Magic Knuckles in the other.
  Now Giants got pretty much everything covered (except Puppetry).
  Dat versatility.

  
  
  Except adding alch skills doesn't necessarily make you anymore versatile since - see the points I've covered before.
  
  Magic knuckles don't have this issue because the load time is comparatively lower for magic, not to mention the crowd control for magic is only temporary and is suitable for melee as a support.
  
  My point is, just don't equip guard cylinder at all. Leave it in your inventory and once in 5 minutes, spend 3- seconds to equip both cylinders to use e-wave.
• Snowie Stormflower wrote on 2013-08-05 08:12

  Quote from wildk;1131787:

  Except adding alch skills doesn't necessarily make you anymore versatile since - see the points I've covered before.
  
  My point is, just don't equip guard cylinder at all. Leave it in your inventory and once in 5 minutes, spend 3- seconds to equip both cylinders to use e-wave.

  
  
  You can't use Elemental Wave if you haven't used the skills to 'charge' the Elements, if I remember correctly.
  Besides, having access to Frozen Blast that way is pretty nifty, too.
• wildk wrote on 2013-08-05 08:13

  Quote from Snowie Stormflower;1131788:

  You can't use Elemental Wave if you haven't use the skills to 'charge' the Elements, if I remember correctly.

  
  
  Would someone, who does 30k in a normal smash, spend 1.5 minute of pure alch skills to charge up e-wave? Remember that wave can only be charged when you're dualing cylinders. Golden time has 5 minute cooldown. As I see it it's much more efficient to just equip a proper shield >.<
  
  

  Quote from Snowie Stormflower;1131788:

  Besides, having access to Frozen Blast that way is pretty nifty, too.

  
  
  Again, normal frozen blast is very fail prone. Very as in 4/5 times.
• Snowie Stormflower wrote on 2013-08-05 08:18

  Quote from wildk;1131789:

  Would someone, who does 30k in a normal smash, spend 1.5 minute to charge up e-wave? Golden time has 5 minute cooldown. As I see it it's much more efficient to just equip a proper shield >.<

  
  
  Using overkill as an example doesn't really help your case.
  If an enemy is a bit away you could just Water Cannon instead of moving to smash it.
  Easy access to Shock is also there.
  
  ---
  
  Although we're all bickering over things we have little to no information about, we'll have to wait and see how it goes.
• wildk wrote on 2013-08-05 08:29

  Quote from Snowie Stormflower;1131791:

  Using overkill as an example doesn't really help your case.
  If an enemy is a bit away you could just Water Cannon instead of moving to smash it.
  Easy access to Shock is also there.
  
  ---
  
  Although we're all bickering over things we have little to no information about, we'll have to wait and see how it goes.

  
  
  Meh, it was just an example. I'm just saying that using alch skills potentially lowers your DPS and interferes with melee combos rather than helping it.
  
  Moving to smash it seems much faster than water cannon -> wait for stun -> wait for AI to roll on an attacking skill and so on.
  
  When it comes out feel free to use it as you please, I've made my point here :P