Invoke IQ Test into the sign-up page (Appeal)

• Ashikoki wrote on 2013-12-13 08:05

  Quote from SlurpTASTY;1178155:

  I think the rule against one-word replies should be removed. Sometimes you don't need to write out a whole sentence to convey the meaning you want to get out. Just because its a one word reply does not mean its worthless spam. I'm not directing this at you specifically but just in general.
  
  Example: Kaeporo posted a max roll encore ambush crash shot frag 5 bohemian, I said gg. Looking back at that thread another user said .................. and another one just said Nice. Yet mine was the only one removed (yes, I do realize there is a certain user reporting my posts), whats the big deal with saying GG to someone who has accomplished something? The whole point of the thread is for people to notice your accomplishments, and I was congratulating a fellow player.
  
  Another offense I had of this was today (which I assume was not reported, which is why it hasn't been removed yet) was saying "Wat." in this thread. I can express my distaste and confusion in the topic in one word, and thats my opinion about the topic, just a simple "Wat." Do I need to write more than is needed just so I'm not infracted? I could've said something like "this topic makes me go Wat because it leaves me dumbfounded" but saying "Wat." conveys the exact same message just as well.
  
  I realize you are all just trying to do your jobs the best as you possibly can, and I do think the infraction system on Mabination is a wonderful thing. Which is why this isn't a complaint towards moderators just doing their jobs and more about some of the rules nation currently has. Just some constructive criticism, take it as you will.

  
  
  I'm on your side, but this was the will of the community vote several months ago. By quite a large margin, mind you.
  
  I don't know if people have changed their minds since then, and if so, I would love to know why. But I'm all for removing this rule. Off topic posting is not nearly as big of a deal as low quality thread spinning in my opinion.
  
  As for posting threads in the wrong board; we always handled it under the assumption that the poster had a poor judgement in placement or was unaware of the site's layout. Being a janitor is just part of the job as a moderator. We currently don't actually have a definitive rule about repeat offenders, though intentional violation certainly falls in to the "trolling / intentional rule breaking" section.
  
  One thread really comes to mind though. The "what did you name your pet" or something thread. People were really upset about that one, for some reason.
  
  I honestly can't actually imagine why such a thread needs to be removed from Mabinogi Talk. It is mabinogi related, it is more of a show and tell rather than a question, everything about it is legit. Just because it isn't a deep and intricate discussion doesn't mean it isn't appropriate for the board. Mind you, nation's "golden days" as everyone trips on, had far more threads of this level than it does now.
  
  Of course, I don't play Mabinogi anymore, so I suppose I don't know what's best for Mabinogi Talk. But among the negative reaction, there were plenty of people who were happily willing to participate in the thread, or even defend it.
  
  The point is, unless it is blatantly obvious that a thread does not belong in a certain board, I see no reason why we can't make the decision to let it slide. Just because you think it absolutely needs to stay out of your board doesn't mean everyone agrees with you either. If it is such a big deal, maybe I'll just split Mabinogi Talk in to a VIP WOW INTELLIGENT DISCUSSION ONLY and SHITPOST HERE. That way I can ban anyone who posts anything that look like the writing of an individual who wouldn't score at least a 4 or 5 on an SAT essay section. /s
  
  Here are my current thoughts on resolving this matter.
  
  1. A balance hotfix patch. Give infractions more weight.
  2. Obtain feedback and specific examples of what could be considered unacceptable posting from vocal members of current issues.
  3. Hold a rule modification community discussion.
• SlurpTASTY wrote on 2013-12-13 08:05

  Quote from ＣＩＲＮＯ;1178169:

  
  
  I mean, what's the point of having an avatar, reputation bar, post counts, gold, pets and all that other fancy stuffs if all you want is to support the above point? Might as well throw in a thumbs up beside the post itself so you can show your support visually or something. There is no need for you to even post if you are only mentally capable of a single word reply to describe how you feel because we can probably guess it already.

  
  
  Because posting "gg" or "wat" once in awhile means I'm incapable of posting anything other than one word replies?
• Cannibal wrote on 2013-12-13 08:14

  Quote from SlurpTASTY;1178172:

  Well to be blunt, I honestly couldn't care less about how long it took someone to finish their gear and saying "GG" is exactly the same as saying "thats really awesome". I do realize substance adds to the conversation but a one word reply can have as much substance to it as a fully written out sentence. I'm not saying my "wat" conveys some whole paragraph of meaning, but it gets my point out there, which is the whole point.
  
  But I actually do see your point, it would be annoying if a bunch of users were always just saying this and wat and gg, but thats the thing, it doesn't happen at such a frequent rate that it's a big problem. Most of Mabination's users contribute greatly to threads, I'd definitely say we don't have that many posters who are constantly adding nothing to threads with silly one word responses. I believe the rules implemented about one word responses were implemented with people like that in mind, but to punish a contributing user for giving a one word response once in awhile doesn't really sit well with me.

  
  
  I see your point, too. You're right, it doesn't happen super often, but if there's no rule for one-word replies, it means they're all okay. In fact, it probably doesn't happen often because people get scolded for it. If it's based on discretion, then people get mad for getting in trouble when "so-and-so did it, too." Mods can never make everyone happy. It's shitty.
• Syliara wrote on 2013-12-13 08:15

  Quote from Ashikoki;1178179:

  The point is, unless it is blatantly obvious that a thread does not belong in a certain board, I see no reason why we can't make the decision to let it slide. Just because you think it absolutely needs to stay out of your board doesn't mean everyone agrees with you either. If it is such a big deal, maybe I'll just split Mabinogi Talk in to a VIP WOW INTELLIGENT DISCUSSION ONLY and SHITPOST HERE. That way I can ban anyone who posts anything that doesn't look like the writing of an individual who wouldn't score at least a 4 or 5 on an SAT essay section. /s
  
  Here are my current thoughts on resolving this matter.
  
  1. A balance hotfix patch. Give infractions more weight.
  2. Obtain feedback and specific examples of what could be considered unacceptable posting from vocal members of current issues.
  3. Hold a rule modification community discussion.

  
  
  Because sometimes a thread isnt so blatant as just reading the title and deciding whether it fits or not. Sometimes its both subtle on its relevance to the forums, but at the same time it just has no reason to exist in those forums. If anything, I'd ask the mods to look more into the threads actual content to decide on its relevance to the forums it is in, and then make a decision on whether or not it actually fits correctly. And that "splitting the mabinogi talk" part was more along the lines of making it more centered around game play instead of general "anything about mabi" threads. This is my opinion, not a big deal to me but would be more happy to see it happen (probably wont, but worth a shot to get it out there), and I know it came off as a bit more elitist how I wrote it but there are still people who care about the combat part of mabi over the other parts (if not then I'm in a class of my own and I'm proud of it :U)....
  
  For the stuff you listed as a fix, fine by me honestly. Just getting the ball rolling and ideas being thrown is good enough of a start, all you need to start a fire is a spark....
  

  
  [FONT=Verdana]I see your point, too. You're right, it doesn't happen super often, but if there's no rule for one-word replies, it means they're all okay. In fact, it probably doesn't happen often because people get scolded for it. If it's based on discretion, then people get mad for getting in trouble when "so-and-so did it, too." Mods can never make everyone happy. It's shitty.[/FONT]

  
  
  No truer words can be spoken on that subject.... It's impossible to make everyone happy.... However, sometimes you just have to deal with it and make the person accept the fact that you were given that power for a reason and are doing with it what you seem fit....
• Sepia wrote on 2013-12-13 08:21

  Quote from Pureblooded;1178186:

  No truer words can be spoken on that subject.... It's impossible to make everyone happy.... However, sometimes you just have to deal with it and make the person accept the fact that you were given that power for a reason and are doing with it what you seem fit....

  
  
  Because that's worked wonders in the past.....
• Syliara wrote on 2013-12-13 08:23

  Quote from Sepia;1178190:

  Because that's worked wonders in the past.....

  
  
  Not much else you can really do besides stay neutral completely and do literally nothing.... You can try to satisfy both sides, but eventually you will come to a point where there is a conflict of interests and you'll be forced to make a decision right then and there....
• ＣＩＲＮＯ wrote on 2013-12-13 09:00

  Quote from SlurpTASTY;1178180:

  Because posting "gg" or "wat" once in awhile means I'm incapable of posting anything other than one word replies?

  
  
  There is nothing wrong with "GG" or "wat" once in awhile, but you have to remember that this is a forum, not a chat room. One word replies work well on chat rooms as because things are going on at real-time, whereas in a forum, people actually take their time to sit down and read, and your post ain't gonna go missing for a long time. For that very reason in particular, I don't see why one-word replies are needed in forums.
• ＣＩＲＮＯ wrote on 2013-12-13 09:00

  Quote from SlurpTASTY;1178180:

  Because posting "gg" or "wat" once in awhile means I'm incapable of posting anything other than one word replies?

  
  
  There is nothing wrong with "GG" or "wat" once in awhile, but you have to remember that this is a forum, not a chat room. One word replies work well on chat rooms as because things are going on at real-time, whereas in a forum, people actually take their time to sit down and read, and your post ain't gonna go missing for a long time. For that very reason in particular, I don't see why one-word replies are needed in forums.
• Justified wrote on 2013-12-13 10:32

  Quote from Pureblooded;1178193:

  Not much else you can really do besides stay neutral completely and do literally nothing....

  
  Haven't you heard the old saying?
  
  

  Quote from Sepia;1178190:

  Because that's worked wonders in the past.....

  
  "If at first you don't succeed, do nothing."
• Snowie Stormflower wrote on 2013-12-13 11:15

  Quote from Ashikoki;1178118:

  For every spam report you've placed, you should have received a feedback with tangible results. Your report was either dismissed or resolved. If resolved, the moderator should have told you exactly what they did (warning, infraction, other action taken, etc).

  
  
  In my feedbacks, I have never done this, basically to avoid childish background play and mockery, for example:
  
  User A reports user B for spamming.
  I agree that it is spam, I remove it and infract user B.
  I proceed to send report feedback and tell user A that user B has been infracted.
  User A reads the feedback and sees news about the infraction.
  User A proceeds to send a mocking PM to user B along the lines of:
  "Ha-ha! You got in-frac-ted!"
  
  Believe it or not, it happens, human nature is a strong drive.
  Which is why I feel that whatever I have done to the person who offended the rules, is none of the reporter's business.
  
  If that HAS to be added though, I'll see to it in the future, but I'll wait for it until the rules are finally revised.
  
  

  Quote from Zeo;1178124:

  I never recieved the PM about it so I was unsure if they did get my report or not.

  
  
  Pretty sure -I- always send report feedback to every report I've touched over the last few months, except to a certain user who has yet to clean their inbox. (You know who you are)
  
  On the subject of feedback though, I have noticed that some users never look at this feedback at all.
  Sometimes in those feedbacks I explain how they can take care of things themselves such as editting or deleting their own posts when they feel like they shouldn't have posted a certain thing.
  Yet I always get similar reports from said users over and over again.
  
  I believe we should have an option when making a report, something like a checkbox that says "Request Feedback".
  Because it is a waste of our time when we type that for someone and they don't even read it.
  
  

  Quote from Ashikoki;1178179:

  -Stuff about 1-word posts.-

  
  
  I have personally also had problems with this, and I mean with dealing with reports related to 1-word posts.
  On one side, I understand the poster's intention, and on the other side, I understand the reporter's frustration.
  Since it being made a rule about half a year ago and such.
  
  Not to mention some posts can take up half to a whole screen now with all the gimmicks in the left bar and signature.
  And some people might just feel annoyed at having to scroll so much extra just to see a bunch of one-word posts.
  
  Perhaps it's time for a compact reading mode or something?
  
  

  Quote from Pureblooded;1178186:

  No truer words can be spoken on that subject.... It's impossible to make everyone happy.... However, sometimes you just have to deal with it and make the person accept the fact that you were given that power for a reason and are doing with it what you seem fit....

  
  
  This is often a problem, a lot of people freak out at a warning already.
  IT GIVES NO INFRACTION POINTS, PEOPLE.
  Just don't repeat the offense for 90 days and you get another shot in the dark again.
  
  When they do get infracted, they fight it with all they can think of, too.
  
  We should have a switched day once, some users don't nearly understand how stressful they can be!
  :shoe:
  
  ---
  
  Finally done catching up, pfoo!
  :hot2:
• Kingofrunes wrote on 2013-12-13 11:27

  Quote from Ashikoki;1178118:

  The report feedback system was put in place to specifically avoid these types of complaints.
  
  For every spam report you've placed, you should have received a feedback with tangible results. Your report was either dismissed or resolved. If resolved, the moderator should have told you exactly what they did (warning, infraction, other action taken, etc).

  
  
  I wish you could enforce it a little better. I suppose the only thing we can do is after 24 hours if we haven't received any feedback to PM you to look into so you can discuss with the offending staff member why they didn't send a feedback report and report back with the reason. That's the only thing I can think of at this point if you can't enforce it. It really is annoying when staff members don't follow the system you carefully crafted out. I have a recent example in fact. I made a report yesterday about a thread being in the wrong section and nobody bothered to send feedback that it had been moved. It's possible that it's due to duplicate reports from different users of the same thing which is understandable but if that's the case then there needs to be rules in place that deal with that kind of situation.
  
  

  Quote from Pureblooded;1178118:

  I feel it should only talk about stats, content (meaning the combat kind), current events, and anything that has direct correlation to the game itself from a player's point of view.

  
  
  Why the heck should it only be the combat kind of content?! I didn't join Mabinogi just do combat all day long.
  
  

  Quote from ＣＩＲＮＯ;1178169:

  I agree with this point. In fact, the points stated in the quote suggests that most users that does 1 word replies (My god, and I thought one-liners are bad...) just steps up with my point that users are lazy, but they are posting for the sake of making replies.
  
  If you are so interested in making one word replies, I suggest that all stats removed and the forum to be degraded to the point that it's just a simple thread (Literally.)
  
  I mean, what's the point of having an avatar, reputation bar, post counts, gold, pets and all that other fancy stuffs if all you want is to support the above point? Might as well throw in a thumbs up beside the post itself so you can show your support visually or something. There is no need for you to even post if you are only mentally capable of a single word reply to describe how you feel because we can probably guess it already.

  
  
  This is something I can get behind. 1 word posts really piss me off and laziness also pisses me off. Take the time to actually think out a quality or semi-quality post instead of doing +1 quick posts.
  
  

  Quote from Ashikoki;1178179:

  One thread really comes to mind though. The "what did you name your pet" or something thread. People were really upset about that one, for some reason.
  
  I honestly can't actually imagine why such a thread needs to be removed from Mabinogi Talk. It is mabinogi related, it is more of a show and tell rather than a question, everything about it is legit.

  
  
  The thread itself is fine. The problem is that Splat made like 5 of these when it really should have been one. Did a new one really have to be made for each and every single bloody pet he got?! Then when a person tried to make a consolidated post for it, it got locked or deleted! I mean that's just, pardon my french here, complete and utter bullshit in my mind.
• Snowie Stormflower wrote on 2013-12-13 12:12

  Quote from Kingofrunes;1178226:

  The thread itself is fine. The problem is that Splat made like 5 of these when it really should have been one. Did a new one really have to be made for each and every single bloody pet he got?! Then when a person tried to make a consolidated post for it, it got locked or deleted! I mean that's just, pardon my french here, complete and utter bullshit in my mind.

  
  
  He didn't actually get all of those pets himself, Splat made those threads for some activity and thought he'd keep it up because he had already started, anyway
  
  I was the one who deleted that thread because if we're gonna apply the logic to those pet threads, we could apply the same to some of the Pokémon ones, which were also originally reported, but kept separate because they were actually different things, even when some people didn't agree on it.
  Same goes for Splat's pet threads, cluttering them into one thread could end up confusing for some while keeping them separate made it easier for the users who did like those threads to find the specific pets they were looking for.
  
  It also made the site look more active like some people wanted (the Pokemon ones).
  
  Besides, there were only 5 of them spread over 5 days, was it really that hard to bear for some?
  I believe the tolerance of some users may have gone down over time recently, even after certain things already happened to lighten the mood around here.
  
  But I digress, tastes differ, what may be seen as world's worst thread to one may be seen as the greatest thing ever to another.
• Kingofrunes wrote on 2013-12-13 12:13
  I see your point but please understand that it still is annoying and frustrating for a lot of people including the OP and I knew a few others on my team also voiced concerns over the issue so it's not an annoyance for just a single person.
• Snowie Stormflower wrote on 2013-12-13 12:26

  Quote from Kingofrunes;1178232:

  I see your point but please understand that it still is annoying and frustrating for a lot of people including the OP and I knew a few others on my team also voiced concerns over the issue so it's not an annoyance for just a single person.

  
  
  I know it wasn't just a single person who got annoyed by it, but the people who liked the threads or supported their existence weren't just 1 person either.
  
  Can't make everyone happy here regardless of how hard I try.
  :gloom3:
• Kingofrunes wrote on 2013-12-13 12:35

  Quote from Snowie Stormflower;1178234:

  I know it wasn't just a single person who got annoyed by it, but the people who liked the threads or supported their existence weren't just 1 person either.
  
  Can't make everyone happy here regardless of how hard I try.
  :gloom3:

  
  
  True, oh well. If people liked it then it should stay. Just because a bunch of us don't like something when a bunch of people do like it doesn't mean it should get removed.
  
  It's honestly not that difficult to ignore it, for me at least. Just was trying to make a case for the complaining side.