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Lan wrote on 2010-08-19 23:13
Quote from Phunkie;131109:
EXACTLY.
The Alchemist uses Alchemy because that his/her playing style. If he wants to summon a Golem, he uses a Cylinder.
If a person wants to attack from a distance, to maintain his safety, he uses a Bow.
If a person prefers dirty, close combat, he equips two swords.
If a person prefers reducing damage taken, he equips a shield.
If a person wants to use powerful magic, he equips an elemental wand.
But if a person wants to equip a Healing Wand, he is only restricted to healing. Well, you don't need a wand to heal in the first place. Oh, Party Healing heals everyone? Get the Master title and drop the wand. It'll allow you to heal wounds and you're good.
The game gives no incentive to use a Healing Wand. Yeah, sure, they will be hard missions. But Healing Wands have no pros in battle. Unlike Combat Wands, they don't have a special skill. (You know what I mean by special.)
The Healer, Cleric... whatever you want to call him... is worthless offensively. He can get an ego Healing Wand and only heal. What in hell is that?
Do you guys not see my point?
So what if they don't have a special attack? They're healers :s They stay back and make sure people don't die. Would you expect a doctor to go out to war? No? So why would a healer whos main job is to heal need one? If they get bored of it they can just switch and stop healing.
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Phunkie wrote on 2010-08-19 23:15
Quote from Lan;131119:
So what if they don't have a special attack? They're healers :s They stay back and make sure people don't die. Would you expect a doctor to go out to war? No? So why would a healer whos main job is to heal need one? If they get bored of it they can just switch and stop healing.
Bards, who were once used to give buffs to a party, were given melee instruments in G13.
Why? Shouldn't their main job be just to play music?
Why can't something similar happen for Healers, in the offense department?
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Chiri wrote on 2010-08-19 23:17
You keep saying Bards don't get the short end of the stick, but we really do.
Buffs don't stack and cost a lot of money, and are useless without depending on a separate skill set.
Using the battle mandolin? It does 1~6 damage...
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Phunkie wrote on 2010-08-19 23:18
Quote from Chiri;131126:
You keep saying Bards don't get the short end of the stick, but we really do.
Buffs don't stack and cost a lot of money, and are useless without depending on a separate skill set.
Using the battle mandolin? It does 1~6 damage...
All aboard the LF>Buffs train!
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Kazuni wrote on 2010-08-19 23:18
Why do you want healers to get a boost so much?
Mages are already overloaded with skills ._.
They can charge bolts or something if they really want to stick to their healing wand.
Ranged attack has like, what, 3 proper offensive skills?
Sure they're a bit more flexible, but if you compare that to the 3 bolts, 3 int. magic, and then more magic attacks in further generations, mages are already well off enough.
Healing = healing. You sit in your corner and you heal. You cast some bolts if you want. I don't think they need any more than that when magic is already overloaded with a lot more skills than any other single class, hybrids excluded.
Also @ bards, they still suck. Imagine proffing up a battle mando for upgrades at 1~6 damage. The buffs don't last long, are pretty expensive for 100 plays, and they may fail. I can't imagine playing a pure bard without any other skill sets to aid it, or more likely, do all the work. They're just another support class that can't stand on their own.
And battle mandolins are basically a melee weapon, you'll need str to do any proper damage, which sucks for elves in general. Bards are like a support version of melee with some mediocre buffs and lolskillz thrown in.
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Phunkie wrote on 2010-08-19 23:21
Quote from Kazuni;131129:
Why do you want healers to get a boost so much?
Why not? Really. Why not?
Why so hesitant towards it? It's not a bad idea.
It would benefit everyone. Just like Thunder. Rank it for the MP, never use it again if you want.
But for those who actually want to use it, let them.
I don't see the problem or understand why it's such a big deal to add a White Magic-ish offensive skill to the Mage repertoire, one that would be strong when used by Healing Wands.
So that way Healers/Clerics don't
just have to heal.
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Kazuni wrote on 2010-08-19 23:22
Quote from Phunkie;131133:
Why not? Really. Why not?
Why so hesitant towards it? It's not a bad idea.
It would benefit everyone. Just like Thunder. Rank it for the MP, never use it again if you want.
But for those who actually want to use it, let them.
I don't see the problem or understand why it's such a big deal to invent a White Magic-ish offensive skill to the Mage repertoire.
I say that archers need more skills than healers ._.
Healers fall in the mages class, which is puffed up enough already.
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Lan wrote on 2010-08-19 23:24
Quote from Phunkie;131133:
Why not? Really. Why not?
Why so hesitant towards it? It's not a bad idea.
It would benefit everyone. Just like Thunder. Rank it for the MP, never use it again if you want.
But for those who actually want to use it, let them.
I don't see the problem or understand why it's such a big deal to add a White Magic-ish offensive skill to the Mage repertoire, one that would be strong when used by Healing Wands.
So that way Healers/Clerics don't just have to heal.
It's not necessary, healers are healers because they want to HEAL.
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Kazuni wrote on 2010-08-19 23:25
Quote from Lan;131143:
It's not necessary, healers are healers because they want to HEAL.
This.
They don't need a specialized offensive skill. Again, it would be too much power into mages.
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Phunkie wrote on 2010-08-19 23:26
I think you guys are too attached to the name Healer, that it doesn't let you see the positives of the idea.
You're all like, Why? Isn't a Healer supposed to heal?
That's completely not the point.
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Hiccup wrote on 2010-08-19 23:29
I don't think Healers NEED to even be considered a class/subclass. For one, Mabinogi revolves around combat, hence the rock-paper-scissors combat style. You can't get anywhere without fighting, well unless you would cap exploration then rebirth, repeat. Which is a waste of money :l Everyone in Mabinogi has/will use healing regardless of the rank. As nice as it is partying with others and for instance keeping a whole team of Infra's in trans throughout a dungeon would be silly, and not grant you much exp.
Just better off leaving it as it is. Unless harder more team oriented dungeons come out.
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Phunkie wrote on 2010-08-19 23:32
Alright, fine. You guys win.
How about this?
Remove the stupid Mana Evaporation thing from Healing Wands. It doesn't make sense that all of your 300 MP should disappear just because you decided to unequip a Wand that you can't use for anything else but Party Healing.
Would that a good compromise?
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Andy-Buddy wrote on 2010-08-19 23:37
I sort of agree, some sort of buffing skill, similar to the effect of party heal's +Def would be nice.
Maybe even a skill that slows monsters, similar to magic shields, and slows monster's speeds and lowers their damage?
Something defensive could be like an isolated bubble where monsters cannot move in or out, and party members can move freely.
Their own version of monster debuffs, and player buffs could be useful.
Mabinogi might make hybridization possible, but there's always diversity of roles in a party.
A healer is just one of those roles.
Their need is questionable, at times, but when needed, you sort of want something a bit more when you're stuck as healer. You can't do much holding a healing wand, and even with bolts, some slightly more effective magic would be nice, maybe... a wind blast for mages?
That skill could be like Blaze, nerfed with all other wands except this time, for healing wands.
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Phunkie wrote on 2010-08-19 23:40
Quote from Andy-Buddy;131161:
Mabinogi might make hybridization possible, but there's always diversity of roles in a party.
A healer is just one of those roles.
Their need is questionable, at times, but when needed, you sort of want something a bit more when you're stuck as healer. You can't do much holding a healing wand, and even with bolts, some slightly more effective magic would be nice, maybe... a wind blast for mages?
That skill could be like Blaze, nerfed with all other wands except this time, for healing wands.
Someone's optimistic.
Thank you.
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Kazuni wrote on 2010-08-19 23:40
Quote from Phunkie;131154:
Alright, fine. You guys win.
How about this?
Remove the stupid Mana Evaporation thing from Healing Wands. It doesn't make sense that all of your 300 MP should disappear just because you decided to unequip a Wand that you can't use for anything else but Party Healing.
Would that a good compromise?
No, because then you'd have to be reduced to a walk when using meditation with or without a wand because that's related to mana evaporation. Also, that's the only thing that's keeping someone from casting something like fireball -> thunder -> ice spear or something.
It was a core part of the idea of a wand.