Thoughts on Renovation?

• Esileruf wrote on 2015-05-17 03:22
  It is still ~30mp for both of them. Whether or not it was reduced 40% overall sneakily, or the rate more likely was not adjusted to fit the 4s cast time, this is pretty much making whats supposed to be the most mana draining skill in the game a cup short of a pint.
  
  Its also if the mana drain wasn't edited as I suspect one of the largest screwups in coding I've seen devcat do thus far. It literally slipped their minds not once but TWICE, and its been like this for a good four months.
• kaozking wrote on 2015-05-17 03:29

  Quote from Darkboy132;1275250:

  Unfortunately, that's not how it works.
  
  

  [Image: http://i.imgur.com/iM9T2ix.png]

  
  
  Mana is consumed by a set amount per second and ends off with how long it takes to cast. As what Esil said, the mana mod processing for Meteor wasn't touched.
  
  
  
  Was Meditation used in any of the two videos I linked? Like I said, Rank Novice/F was clearly not used.

  
  
  Its the same as a casting speed reforge, faster casting = faster mana consumption I dont see where you dont get that. Also there is no definite proof to show that it is not rank N/F unless they showed it in the video and I missed it because they never showed the actual rank but we just have to go off is a radius and yes in one of your videos he is using meditation.
• Darkboy132 wrote on 2015-05-17 03:34

  Quote from kaozking;1275253:

  we just have to go off is a radius.

  
  
  

  Quote from Darkboy132:

  8 stamina is being used per second (which is C-A's mana cost per sec currently).

  
  
  :mad:
  
  Furthermore, Kenero's video shows Hail Storm using 50 MP for loading, and then 4 MP per sec during its duration. [S]That clearly indicate that he doesn't have the Druid staff upgraded for mana reduction.[/S] No, that's actually the Celtic Guardian which doesn't have the huge mana reduction upgrade.
• Kapra wrote on 2015-05-17 03:37
  Is there a thread tool that makes certain threads not show up as new posts?. . . This conversation keeps changing the forum marker color.
• kaozking wrote on 2015-05-17 03:39

  Quote from Darkboy132;1275254:

  :mad:
  
  Furthermore, Kenero's video shows Hail Storm using 50 MP for loading, and then 4 MP during its duration. That clearly indicate that he doesn't have the Druid staff upgraded for mana reduction.

  
  
  DId you miss the part where i said faster charge = faster mana consumption
  
  30 mp/4 second = 7.5 mp a second
• Darkboy132 wrote on 2015-05-17 03:42

  Quote from kaozking;1275257:

  DId you miss the part where i said faster charge = faster mana consumption

  
  
  Okay, why is Hail Storm using the exact same MP for pre, and why is Meteor not?
• Kaeporo wrote on 2015-05-17 03:47

  Quote from Oberynn;1275245:

  But why does it matter?

  
  
  I'm with you on this one.
  
  It doesn't really matter if Meteor Strike costs 10 mana or 500 mana. It's inaccessible enough to newer players that reducing the cost won't alter its usage. This is a trivial matter at best.
  
  Mana Recovery will have the same impact. Higher level players will naturally receive the greatest benefit and it's not like we run out of mana outside of heavy Firebolt spam or Mana Shield use. Firebolt already has low usage, this won't really change that. The only real impact that this might have is an increase in Mana Shield usage. I don't really see that as being a bad thing.
  
  My only argument against Mana Recovery is that it's a redundant skill. They should have simply changed Meditation to incorporate its effects.
  
  Again, Mana Recovery isn't "killing" Meditation or potion making. Those skills have sucked for eons.
• M wrote on 2015-05-17 04:28
  They should have just uncapped meditation and revamped it if anything. Still, it's not like it matters since as it has already been said: high level players never had mana problems anyway (with endless pots, trans, etc) and low level players probably dont have access to the skills which drain mana the most. I guess it'll be good for new to mid level mages but the impact will be minor.
• gundamweed wrote on 2015-05-17 06:09

  Quote from Kenero;1275197:

  Hm, I met a giant who was complaining that because of the melee renovation, humans are dangerously close to giants. He complained that final hit completely decimated his target in a group, and even more that celtic royal knights only get the enhancement and while the hammer gets nothing.
  
  What is your opinion? Do people really think humans are dangerously close to giants in terms of close combat (excluding fighter, puppets, etc.) ?

  
  
  As a giant player, I feel this update makes humans actually ahead of giants. How so? Bash replaces smash as the single target damage dealer. Smash, even with a giant's natural 600%, with a lance, and a thames set, its dps cannot compete with bash. Smash's use is best for burst instead, relying on other set ups such as rage impact and support shot so its damage can compete. Now, of course giants can use a fanatic to bash, but humans have access to the best bash option with celtic royal knight swords. Giants don't not have weapons that are at least at normal speed that they can dual wield and special upgrade. I can't say enough about final hit, it's completely broken and totally steals the show from any giant present in a party.
  
  What do giants have over humans now, damage-wise?
• koishi-sempai wrote on 2015-05-17 06:23
  let me ask - why are we arguing that it's a tragedy that mages don't have their ability to fight gated by a resource, when melee, range, puppetry, fighter, alchemy, gunner and ninja have NEVER been truly gated by stamina?
  
  like, stamina is literally a problem only if you never ever pot.
  
  if you're so concerned about the sanctity of resource management, then we should 10x the cost of every single stam consuming skill, then we can talk.
• Syliara wrote on 2015-05-17 06:28

  Quote from gundamweed;1275277:

  As a giant player, I feel this update makes humans actually ahead of giants. How so? Bash replaces smash as the single target damage dealer. Smash, even with a giant's natural 600%, with a lance, and a thames set, its dps cannot compete with bash. Smash's use is best for burst instead, relying on other set ups such as rage impact and support shot so its damage can compete. Now, of course giants can use a fanatic to bash, but humans have access to the best bash option with celtic royal knight swords. Giants don't not have weapons that are at least at normal speed that they can dual wield and special upgrade. I can't say enough about final hit, it's completely broken and totally steals the show from any giant present in a party.
  
  What do giants have over humans now, damage-wise?

  
  
  Giants need something over humans? Races need to be ahead in something over another race? I dont get the point of wanting one race to be better in another thing than another race when in the end it doesnt even make a difference. This game is completely unbalanced and will stay that way probably till it dies. I dont see why people constantly complain one race is worse than the other when in the end you can still one shot things as any race, not to mention this isnt even a competitive gaming atmosphere game, why does it matter what race is better in so and so.
  
  I'm not seeing the point in people worrying about which race is better in what when elves can still hit like 200k crit bashes, giants can hit 90k throwing attacks and humans can do the same in both. In the end everything still melts regardless of what race you are and wat ur using on that race.
• gundamweed wrote on 2015-05-17 06:46

  Quote from Nui;1275280:

  Giants need something over humans? Races need to be ahead in something over another race? I dont get the point of wanting one race to be better in another thing than another race when in the end it doesnt even make a difference. This game is completely unbalanced and will stay that way probably till it dies. I dont see why people constantly complain one race is worse than the other when in the end you can still one shot things as any race, not to mention this isnt even a competitive gaming atmosphere game, why does it matter what race is better in so and so.
  
  I'm not seeing the point in people worrying about which race is better in what when elves can still hit like 200k crit bashes, giants can hit 90k throwing attacks and humans can do the same in both. In the end everything still melts regardless of what race you are and wat ur using on that race.

  
  
  The point of a giant is that they're supposed to be the best in melee, and a while ago, this was exactly the case. There was meaning in being a giant due to that benefit. But now? Come on, don't give me that cheap cop out of a response while humans are soloing MA with a single FH use.
• Syliara wrote on 2015-05-17 07:06

  Quote from gundamweed;1275282:

  The point of a giant is that they're supposed to be the best in melee, and a while ago, this was exactly the case. There was meaning in being a giant due to that benefit. But now? Come on, don't give me that cheap cop out of a response while humans are soloing MA with a single FH use.

  
  
  Giants and elves were soloing MA with other methods so I dont see how that point is really valid in this argument.
  
  Does it say somewhere that giants have to be the best in melee or that they need to be ahead of other classes in melee? The same can be said for elves and humans. Racial stereotypes make it seem like one race is supposed to be the best in something when in the end theres nothing saying that another race cant be better in it instead. Giants still rape things with melee and elves can still destroy things with range, just because something else has an edge over that thats not in their race doesnt mean its something that shouldnt be happening.
• ironwoman wrote on 2015-05-17 07:16
  Giant Smash with even just Smash accessories will outdamage/DPS bash.
  
  If the said Giant actually has decent damage, you can see it shine through various multipliers, like rage impact, support shot, combo cards, etc.
• gundamweed wrote on 2015-05-17 07:26

  Quote from ironwoman;1275284:

  Giant Smash with even just Smash accessories will outdamage/DPS bash.
  
  If the said Giant actually has decent damage, you can see it shine through various multipliers, like rage impact, support shot, combo cards, etc.

  
  
  I really doubt you've worked out the math.